WHO WINS?


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mastermind

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I think many on the left of the spectrum just refuse to admit that Americans area a right wing leaning populace overall and a lot of Conservative types actually vote for Dems and there are a ton more of those types than dyed in the wool Progressives in the dem camp, our country has started to become culturally more liberal overall and I think that causes many to overestimate this into a more outwardly left wing Democratic party that is just "oppressing" the progressive wing when really many of the party's base is still fairly boring centrists with a often Conservative streak and this is who has to be catered to.
What issues do you think Americans are right wing on? Health care? Good wages so they don’t live in struggle? The environment?

I don’t think Americans exist in a right wing/left wing world as much as they view things through how questions are presented. The issue is the wealthy are the ones who present the questions and thus it’s framed in a way that’s advantageous to them.
 
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If the polls were being weighed like 2020, Harris would be up similarly in national polls. The problem is twofold. On one hand the serious, high quality pollsters are constantly over sampling unlikely or unreliable voters in order to get odd results that favor ties. On the other hand, just like in 2022 we're seeing bullshyt polls from republican firms that show ties or slight Trump leads. The aggregates like RCP throw it all in the same pool and here we are.

NV is full of older voters and anyone who has paid attention to elections knows old people vote first, younger people vote later or at the last minute. Given the huge gains democrats made in NV this past weekend, especially from Clark, it's clear what's going on. If they election was this Tuesday then sure I'd agree with Ralston. But it's not.

The Georgia numbers look good for Harris. The black numbers out of Atlanta look amazing and if you think the huge spike of young white women voting in Fulton County is good news for Trump/republicans, I have a bridge in Alaska to sell you.

The early voting numbers in MI and PA look really good for Harris as well. I haven't seen anything that gives me pause or concern yet.
I would add to this excellent post that the pollsters are struggling to weight their polls properly because we're completing a party re-alignment that hasn't been seen on this level in sixty years. If Harris wins this by forging a coalition of educated whites (particularly white women), black voters, and urban blue-collar unionized workers, that's a new winning coalition. She'd be winning by getting college-degree holding whites in the suburbs and black/brown/white urban voters in the same voting coalition in numbers we hadn't seen before.

And with the way Republicans are moving, it's going to be white men + poor rural and exurban whites + well-off brown immigrants (Venezuelans, Cubans) on their side vs. educated whites (especially women) + black/brown/white voters in the cities (incl. working class voters in these groups) on the Dem side.

The GOP has been working their asses off to destroy their previous advantage in the suburbs by running toward Trump. If they were smart, they'd have told the rurals to shut the fukk up and get in line with their Romney-style candidates ten years ago, softened the overt racism and made it more easily deniable, then targeted upwardly mobile black and brown Americans. Trying to hold on to the evangelical Christian population to avoid a party split was probably a mistake. Had they cut them adrift and then targeted the growing amount of high-earning women, black, and brown folks, they could have occupied the center-right and grown their party.
What issues do you think Americans are right wing on? Health care? Good wages so they don’t live in struggle? The environment?

I don’t think Americans exist in a right wing/left wing world as much as they view things through how questions are presented. The issue is the wealthy are the ones who present the questions and thus it’s framed in a way that’s advantageous to them.

I think this is right, though I also see the OG poster's point. On the one hand, the move to the right on immigration was bound to happen because people very easily are convinced that immigrants are destroying the fabric of the nation, the economy, etc., etc. We need to understand that the Dems are a large tent and a lot of that tent has positions that we'd describe as "to the right," especially if we're more progressive (I consider myself to the left of most people who vote for the Democratic Party and simplify things in this way).

On the other hand, all this comes back to racism. I said it a few days ago, but you take the Trumpiest Trumper in the group, and they love social programs. If there were no black or brown folks in this country, it would have the same social systems in place as Norway or Japan. It's just that historically, and we can list example after example of this, they have consistently voted to be broke and starving to avoid black people getting a small come-up as well.

These rural Trumpers would love to exterminate black Americans because then they'd be able to go after their social programs they want with no compunctions. And that's why the wealthy present these programs as a race-focused question rather than a question of social or economic health. If these questions were presented as class-focused, and if everyone agreed that regardless of race, we're all part of a class struggle for these programs, they'd have to start contributing financially to this country that has helped uplift them and their ridiculous wealth.
 

Outlaw

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I would add to this excellent post that the pollsters are struggling to weight their polls properly because we're completing a party re-alignment that hasn't been seen on this level in sixty years. If Harris wins this by forging a coalition of educated whites (particularly white women), black voters, and urban blue-collar unionized workers, that's a new winning coalition. She'd be winning by getting college-degree holding whites in the suburbs and black/brown/white urban voters in the same voting coalition in numbers we hadn't seen before.

And with the way Republicans are moving, it's going to be white men + poor rural and exurban whites + well-off brown immigrants (Venezuelans, Cubans) on their side vs. educated whites (especially women) + black/brown/white voters in the cities (incl. working class voters in these groups) on the Dem side.

The GOP has been working their asses off to destroy their previous advantage in the suburbs by running toward Trump. If they were smart, they'd have told the rurals to shut the fukk up and get in line with their Romney-style candidates ten years ago, softened the overt racism and made it more easily deniable, then targeted upwardly mobile black and brown Americans. Trying to hold on to the evangelical Christian population to avoid a party split was probably a mistake. Had they cut them adrift and then targeted the growing amount of high-earning women, black, and brown folks, they could have occupied the center-right and grown their party.


I think this is right, though I also see the OG poster's point. On the one hand, the move to the right on immigration was bound to happen because people very easily are convinced that immigrants are destroying the fabric of the nation, the economy, etc., etc. We need to understand that the Dems are a large tent and a lot of that tent has positions that we'd describe as "to the right," especially if we're more progressive (I consider myself to the left of most people who vote for the Democratic Party and simplify things in this way).

On the other hand, all this comes back to racism. I said it a few days ago, but you take the Trumpiest Trumper in the group, and they love social programs. If there were no black or brown folks in this country, it would have the same social systems in place as Norway or Japan. It's just that historically, and we can list example after example of this, they have consistently voted to be broke and starving to avoid black people getting a small come-up as well.

These rural Trumpers would love to exterminate black Americans because then they'd be able to go after their social programs they want with no compunctions. And that's why the wealthy present these programs as a race-focused question rather than a question of social or economic health. If these questions were presented as class-focused, and if everyone agreed that regardless of race, we're all part of a class struggle for these programs, they'd have to start contributing financially to this country that has helped uplift them and their ridiculous wealth.
Ironically, Biden governed as the most economic populist President in all of our lifetimes yet the rural whites hate him. This all boils down to racism, to say this is a class struggle is putting lipstick on an ugly pig. It all boils down to race for MAGA
 

bnew

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1/1
@KamalaHQ
Tonight, Trump:

—Once again said Americans who don’t support him are “the enemy within”
—Announced that Americans should “get ready” for him to bring back laws from the 1700s
—Attacked journalists as “enemies” and fantasized about “decapitating” a reporter
—Denigrated America and attacked U.S. military leadership, calling them “stupid”



https://video-t-2.twimg.com/ext_tw_...848/pu/vid/avc1/1280x720/p_772Y0iL4onlNGJ.mp4
https://video-t-2.twimg.com/ext_tw_...632/pu/vid/avc1/1280x720/1ml8VYbq3Mh1kYT1.mp4
https://video-t-2.twimg.com/ext_tw_...336/pu/vid/avc1/1280x720/F7fYL_jy3YY_JPGL.mp4
https://video-t-2.twimg.com/ext_tw_...864/pu/vid/avc1/1280x720/o6ds9kldjAF5_-5V.mp4


To post tweets in this format, more info here: https://www.thecoli.com/threads/tips-and-tricks-for-posting-the-coli-megathread.984734/post-52211196
 

King Static X

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I wasn't worried about this before, but I am now. It's been a week. What's going on? Are Dems going to lose Nevada?

One of you that lives in Nevada, tell me what's going on? :dwillhuh:
 
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