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What do you think about the points presented in this scene? (Violence/Human Nature)
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thats a good scene...great dialogue
People forget that, u take away how intelligent hmo sapiens are/have evolved into, the "meaning of life" is to survive by any means necessary, to be the head of the pack, and to reproduce
People forget that, u take away how intelligent hmo sapiens are/have evolved into, the "meaning of life" is to survive by any means necessary, to be the head of the pack, and to reproduce
VerbalIntercourse
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Violence is a part of human nature.
Take a look at history--From the fossil record of the paleolithic era to the 1900's and beyond.
Kennwick man looked very different from the people who inhabited the Americas. Is that why his body was littered with arrow points and traumatic damage?
We are controlled by tribalism, racism, violence and apathy, it's a part of all of us. However, it's a bell curve. there is a small minority that is ultra violent and a small minority that is always passive.
Nature made us this way because nature rewards the most violent. From the Zulu's that violently consolidated the Zulu nation, to the Mongols who spread their genes across Eurasia, to the European decedents who have control and majority populations on Multiple continents.
Say what you want about peace.......
Israel expanded its territory by 100% (iirc), and never gave it back. They got that land through violence. Moreover, They get to subjugate their enemies, and remove them from their homes without legal recourse.
I don't think that is necessarily true, it's all relative. If you are struggling, then yeah that makes sense, but the rules change once you have what you need. Then it's all about pleasure. Even at the lower basic level, it's about pleasure, but being that you are barely surviving, you resort to violence to MAINTAIN the things that bring you pleasure if you are around crazy people who are greedy, and want what you have or the basic necessities are in short supply so you have to protect what you have which brings paranoia,and being constantly alert which means you will be cautious of everyone who isn't part of your tribe or group because you don't know their intentions are.
I think that violence is really something done to protect against crazy, narcissistic people who tend to resort to violence to get what they want. To say nature made us this way is only seeing some of the picture. Mental disorder plays a big part on why the world is the way it is. We are diagnosing it now, but it has always been there. Even today, the people who tend to be in powerful occupations show heavy traits of narcissism. This is easily seen when you look at how corporations, and governments, are fukking up the world. In ancient times they just had a different name(church&royalty). In the animal, world it most likely happens but we see it as an animal being aggressive and strong but it may have brain problems and seeing things in a distorted way. Look at at pitbulls, when living in a wonderful, loving environment, they don't have a lot of aggression, but when raised in a hostile one they do and it passes on to their children until it is bred out of them. The hostile environment is most likely stressing their brain, and causing the aggression not because they naturally are.
I think it proves crazy people are not always seen as crazy(looks, career) until you get a chance to talk with them, and see how they have a twisted view of reality which means you better protect yourself or be a victim, which si what they want. They love violence, and confrontation as this keeps their brains alive and balance them out. As 50 cent said when he was beefing with bang 'em smurf at hot 97 summerjam, "I love the drama motherfukker"
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I understand where you are coming from, but I feel you and the other posters took it a bit off course.
I was merely asking about discussing the various points the Warden made.
1) God gave us violence to wage in his honor.
2) Violence is inherent in nature and humans rely on society to provide an illusion that the aforementioned fact isn't so.
3) Violence, even in self defense is violence.
VerbalIntercourse
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[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoB0pdhxfZs"]Evolution in Action: The Silver Fox Experiment - YouTube[/ame]
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I don't understand why you posted this video because it could mean one of them has a major mental disorder and causing a hostile environment for the rest which is like my pitbull analogy which is why they did what they did in the video.
You do know there was a study that showed when the chimpanzese or monkeys, I can't remember, who caused problems in a group were displaced, the group became more peaceful and everyone got along better. I wish I could find the study but I saw it on pbs a few years ago. I will try to find it so you can see I'm not bullshytting you.
As far as the foxes, I saw that also but in another study, and to me it showed the lighter fur animal who came out tame was because they were weaker, while the dark fur ones were more aggressive because they were stronger. Remember they are in CAGES and your natural inclination is to be free not locked up all day and can't move. After a while you will either fight or just give up. It seems to me the light fur animals were born with low adrenaline and therefore didn't have the strength to fight back. Look at the environment they are in, and then study why they are reacting the way they are. Melanin(dark color) is made form tyrosine which turns into dopamine which helps build adrenaline and gets the muscles moving as well as causing the brain to want to move the body as well as deal with a problem. If you are locked up, and can't move around, you will eventually fight the person who you think is causing your restraint. An animal is intelligent to know this and will attack the person who opens the cage. The video says it's int he genes, BUT what did they do in the environment that could have caused the genes to stay the same or change in some as to where one fox can be born aggressive but the mother was tame. Was the mother high in adrenaline, at the time of conceiving her child and therefor the child came out more aggressive then the mother?.
VerbalIntercourse
Banned
a long-term study of Chimpanzee wars found that the victors had a expanded their territory and resources. Nature rewarded them.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/22/science/22chimp.html?_r=0
Nature rewards the most violent and most aggressive.
Here... Watch the end of this video.
http://worldsciencefestival.com/videos/evolution
These are all top scientists. What do they all conclude? Human beings weren't born to be peaceful hippies.
well I think a key part is when he talks about the "constraints of society"
this is kinda similar to the atheist/morals debate, in that it assumes those "constraints of society" were created one day by humans/god (and that before that we were just mindlessly killing eachother or some shyt), and didn't evolve from behaviors of our social ancestors
it's also an argument I hate where people assume that because they think a certain way, you must think the same way
this is kinda similar to the atheist/morals debate, in that it assumes those "constraints of society" were created one day by humans/god (and that before that we were just mindlessly killing eachother or some shyt), and didn't evolve from behaviors of our social ancestors
it's also an argument I hate where people assume that because they think a certain way, you must think the same way
Wow, I think humans severly underestimate the intelligence of other creatures on the planet. And to assert we are the only self-conscious beings on this planet is probably false. I've been watching videos on apes and chimps lately and there is some evidence of extremely intelligent behavior. Maybe they cant communicate with us in a way that seems conscious, but they probably have some rudimentary form of consciousness, or even thoughts inside their heads.
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They definitely have minds. I am writing on that right now.
VerbalIntercourse
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i don't think intelligence has any bearing on innate aggressive behavior
Again, I saw a study where they removed these aggressive animals and the group became peaceful and loving of one another. No hierarchy, at least the way we see it, and everyone got along. I wish I can remember what it was but I can't but it was on pbs.
Again, you have to study the environment. Also, who is the one conducting the study because if you want to find violence being the way it's supposed to be, that is what you will find. I don't care because it doesn't change the fact in what I find in my own life, and that is the intelligent man who can use violence, and manipulation to protect himself against the crazy, power thirsty people will always be on top BUT on top doesn't mean being a king or having people adore you, but living in peace, and happiness which is eating good food, having good sex, and enjoying friends and family in good health. A narcissist person will look at me like I'm weak because they have a thirst for being a king, and the best but they usually aren't, and tend to resort to violence to get what they want. I have seen agreesive violence first hand, and it doesn't work in the long run, I don't care what a scientist states, I lived it. The one who can humble himself and work with others will always win in LIFE. I seen it firsthand.