Thinking Basketball: Steph Curry & Draymond Green are an all-time duo
- Thread starter Remote
- Start date
BlueHeffner
Veteran
Goat defender and Goat offensive player
We ain't gone disrespect the splash like that.
Watch the video before commenting por favor.
Nah. You can provide cliffs. I got better shyt to do than spend 10 minutes on wait and see youtube videos.
I've been saying it for a long damn time: having Steph is essentially having an extra man on offense, and having Dray is essentially having an extra man on defense. The probability of the two most impactful players ever on their respective ends would end up together and stay together is incalculable, even more so when you take into account the chemistry they have, where it seems like their minds are intertwined.
They play one game, and everyone else is playing another.
It's a cheat code that nobody has been able to break. We'll never see anything like it again, well, not in our lifetime.
They play one game, and everyone else is playing another.
It's a cheat code that nobody has been able to break. We'll never see anything like it again, well, not in our lifetime.
No you don’t. LolNah. You can provide cliffs. I got better shyt to do than spend 10 minutes on wait and see youtube videos.
Any competent player next to Steph Curry is an all-time duo
Draymond is certainly talented and skilled, and deserves the praise he’s gotten
But let’s not get it twisted, Klay and Dray are feasting off Curry. Steph is the tide that raises all ships
Draymond is certainly talented and skilled, and deserves the praise he’s gotten
But let’s not get it twisted, Klay and Dray are feasting off Curry. Steph is the tide that raises all ships
Cornershooter
Banned
draymond green is a high iq player with zero ego that played with 2 of the best shooters of all time(steph and klay) and Kevin Durant. draymond doesn’t try to prove he’s as good as them like most players would. He’s so much more smarter then most players on the floor you can see it . Whenever a player does the same move more then twice you can see draymond lurking to strip it the 3rd time that’s just one example I thought of on the top of my head . He handled business and did what he was supposed to do. 4 rings and got paid .
shyt skill set as a offensive player though
shyt skill set as a offensive player though
I was just discussing this with the homie after Game 6, that a lot of the pushback to Steph's and Dray's greatness is there's no prototype for either of them.
A lot of the hate comes from a place of not understanding how to scale their impact.
We've all been conditioned by great players monopolizing the ball, their style of play and the volume of box score stats that come naturally with that, so when a player like Steph comes along and has all this success playing without needing to be all up in the videos with the ball in his hands, it's hard for folks to contextualize that. Which only leads them to falling into the trap of believing that it must not be because of him, which is only magnified by the fact he's a undersized guard who's not ultra-athletic (conventional wisdom is wings/bigs are the ones who have the most impact on the game).
Same goes for Draymond. His lack of an offensive skillset has always been at the forefront when discussing his game, but I put it down to folks resorting to jokes about it to cover up not knowing why he's historically great, even when he's not a scoring threat. We've all been conditioned by great defensive players in 1v1 situations; ISO has predominately been the main source of offense since the inception of the sport. It's only in recent times where the NBA has been a positionless state where defending your matchup isn't the be-all and end-all. Now, with the freedom that players have, Draymond doesn't just defend his opposite, but he defends 1-5, he defends all PnR actions, he defends multiple players in the same possession (some times multiple players at once), he directs traffic telling his teammates where to be, he protects the rim while simultaneously defending the perimeter, he'll snuff out actions before a team even has a chance to execute them. Every single imaginable act on defense - Draymond can do it. But because nobody in NBA history has done that before, folks don't understand how to measure his impact, which like Steph, is only magnified by the fact he's an undersized big who's not ultra-athletic.
They've both broken the scale on how we judge players. It's why the arguments against them are more reflective of a lack of understanding on how two undersized, lesser-athletic players, who have no predecessor, can be this successful.
A lot of the hate comes from a place of not understanding how to scale their impact.
We've all been conditioned by great players monopolizing the ball, their style of play and the volume of box score stats that come naturally with that, so when a player like Steph comes along and has all this success playing without needing to be all up in the videos with the ball in his hands, it's hard for folks to contextualize that. Which only leads them to falling into the trap of believing that it must not be because of him, which is only magnified by the fact he's a undersized guard who's not ultra-athletic (conventional wisdom is wings/bigs are the ones who have the most impact on the game).
Same goes for Draymond. His lack of an offensive skillset has always been at the forefront when discussing his game, but I put it down to folks resorting to jokes about it to cover up not knowing why he's historically great, even when he's not a scoring threat. We've all been conditioned by great defensive players in 1v1 situations; ISO has predominately been the main source of offense since the inception of the sport. It's only in recent times where the NBA has been a positionless state where defending your matchup isn't the be-all and end-all. Now, with the freedom that players have, Draymond doesn't just defend his opposite, but he defends 1-5, he defends all PnR actions, he defends multiple players in the same possession (some times multiple players at once), he directs traffic telling his teammates where to be, he protects the rim while simultaneously defending the perimeter, he'll snuff out actions before a team even has a chance to execute them. Every single imaginable act on defense - Draymond can do it. But because nobody in NBA history has done that before, folks don't understand how to measure his impact, which like Steph, is only magnified by the fact he's an undersized big who's not ultra-athletic.
They've both broken the scale on how we judge players. It's why the arguments against them are more reflective of a lack of understanding on how two undersized, lesser-athletic players, who have no predecessor, can be this successful.
"The real voyage of discovery lies not in seeking new landscapes but in seeing with new eyes" -- Marcel Proust
Point being, we have to look at basketball with new eyes and once we do, we gain a bigger appreciation of the game and its players. As you've stated, we've been conditioned to view the game a certain way and judge everything within that paradigm or archetype or context. I'm not even sure what the right word is to use. It's an outdated model nonetheless.
But you're right. Unfortunately the world moves slowly. Media doesn't help further things along with their insistence on narratives and drumming up silly controversies (something Draymond actually directly referenced in his post-game interview/podcast the other night when talking about Kendrick Perkins and others).
Perhaps the most frustrating thing is that when someone does try to explain or post evidence for why players like Curry and Draymond and others are so good and undervalued, the public simply refuses to look at it.
This thread has maybe 11 comments on it? A couple hundred views compared to the thousands for something like Skip Bayless/SAS capping.
I'm not saying everyone needs to agree with the Thinking Basketball page (although it is great). They can find several other Youtube pages, Twitter accounts, websites and more to understand what is happening on a deeper level than just PPG/RPG/APG and Rings/Accolades.
I try not to be too pontificating about this sort of thing because even a few years ago I was highly ignorant to a lot of the subtleties of the modern NBA. (though admittedly it is fun to troll now and then)
Offensively, without a doubt, Dray's existence on that end would be entirely different if it weren't for Steph (which yes, is a testament to Steph's greatness, because no other superstar in NBA history would have this amount of success with Dray), but as the video points out, Dray on the other end of the floor is basically unmatched.
That's what makes them such a great duo, is that Draymond is allowed to be the best version of himself and have the defensive end as his stage because of how Steph makes him "playable" on the offensive end. And Steph wouldn't have the success he's had if there wasn't a Draymond on the other end of the floor.
They're extensions of one another.
IIVI
Superstar
I've already broke down Steph's impact in a few threads, but if anybody is still confused as to what Draymond brings, check this video of the payoff preview and what dude had to say about Draymond. Timestamped at ~14:00:
Then you can combine that with how he was used when playing against the Mavs:
Dude who makes these videos is who Haralabos Voulgaris describes as one of the most knowledgeable people on the game btw and constantly has exchanges with that guy on twitter. Same guy is also endorsed by some legit NBA staff so the breakdowns are great.
Speaking of Haralabos Voulgaris:
Then you can combine that with how he was used when playing against the Mavs:
Dude who makes these videos is who Haralabos Voulgaris describes as one of the most knowledgeable people on the game btw and constantly has exchanges with that guy on twitter. Same guy is also endorsed by some legit NBA staff so the breakdowns are great.
Speaking of Haralabos Voulgaris:
Last edited:
Think it's become more and more apparent that Draymond is more important to Warriors' success than Klay. Klay is an amazing player but Draymond is more essential.
Still wondering how y'all explain Klay/Draymond taking care of business so easily in 2016 when Steph was out for two series.
Green-Payton-Poole-Porter-Wiggins
Green-Poole-Porter-Klay-Wiggins
Green-Looney-Poole-Klay-Wiggins
were all very effective lineups for the Warriors this year. That doesn't happen if Draymond isn't a GOAT defender AND effective distributor.
Still wondering how y'all explain Klay/Draymond taking care of business so easily in 2016 when Steph was out for two series.
Green-Payton-Poole-Porter-Wiggins
Green-Poole-Porter-Klay-Wiggins
Green-Looney-Poole-Klay-Wiggins
were all very effective lineups for the Warriors this year. That doesn't happen if Draymond isn't a GOAT defender AND effective distributor.