The Official Anabolic Thread

Waterproof

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(Clomiphene Citrate)

Clomid (Clomiphene Citrate) is a powerfully effective anti-estrogen officially classified as a Selective Estrogen Receptor Modulator (SERM). In many ways, it is very similar to another popular SERM in Nolvadex(Tamoxifen Citrate). Clomid first gained worldwide attention in the early 1970’s as a strong fertility aid and is still used for that purpose today. It is also one of the most commonly used SERM’s by anabolic steroidusers. No, it is not an anabolic steroid but can be used to combat estrogenic side effects sometimes caused by anabolic steroids. It can also be used as a Post Cycle Therapy (PCT) medication in order to stimulate suppressed testosteroneproduction due to anabolic steroid use. PCT use of Clomid is the most common purpose and most beneficial point of use for the anabolic steroid user.

Clomid Functions & Traits:
Clomiphene Citrate is a SERM that is specifically used as a fertility aid due to its ability to enhance the release of gonadotropins. Clomid has the ability to oppose the negative feedback of estrogenson the Hypothalamic-Pituitary-Ovarian-Axis. This will increase the release of Luteinizing Hormone (LH) and Follicle Stimulating Hormone (FSH) significantly. By increasing gonadotropin release, this can lead to the egg being released, thereby increasing the chance of conception.

Clomid also carries strong anti-estrogen properties that could be used therapeutically, but its anti-estrogen properties are most commonly associated with anabolic steroid use. Testosterone and many testosterone derived steroids have the ability to convert to estrogen through testosterone’s interaction with the aromatase enzyme. As estrogen levels rise, this can lead to gynecomastia and excess water retention. Heavy water retention can also promote high blood pressure. By supplementing with Clomid during anabolic steroid use, the SERM will bind to the estrogen receptors, therefore inhibiting the estrogen hormone from binding. This can be very useful in combating gynecomastia, as when Clomid binds to the receptor it prevents estrogen from stimulating the mammary tissue. It can also have a positive impact on water retention, but as it won’t actively reduce serum estrogen levels it’s sometimes not enough.

Clomid also possess functioning traits that are beneficial to the anabolic steroid user post anabolic steroid use. Specifically we’re referring to Post Cycle Therapy (PCT). In men, Clomid also has the ability to stimulate the pituitary to release more LH and FSH, which will in turn stimulate enhanced natural testosterone production. This is extremely beneficial to the anabolic steroid user post cycle as natural testosterone levels will be very low due to suppression caused by anabolic steroid use.
 

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Effects of Clomid:
In a therapeutic setting as a fertility aid, the effects of Clomid are simple. The woman is having difficulty becoming pregnant, Clomid enhances the chance of conception and pregnancy occurs. It doesn’t always work and we’ll look at the process in the administration section, but it will greatly increase the odds of conception and is fairly successful.

As an anti-estrogen for on cycle steroid use, Clomid is fairly effective at staving off gynecomastia. It will not reduce estrogen levels or inhibit the aromatization process, but in many cases, binding to the receptors is enough protection for many men. In fact, while there are stronger protective agents, many men would be surprised as to how well a SERM like Clomid can work if they would give it a chance. More importantly, when using Clomid for this purpose it can also have a positive impact on cholesterol levels. While an anti-estrogen, Clomid actually acts as estrogen in the liver, which in turn will promote healthier cholesterol levels. This can be very beneficial to the anabolic steroid user as anabolic steroid use is notorious for promoting unhealthy cholesterol levels.

For many men, especially hardcore anabolic steroid users, Clomid is not enough for estrogenic protection. In this case, an Aromatase Inhibitor (AI) like Arimidex(Anastrozole) or Femara (Letrozole) will be needed. AI’s actively inhibit the aromatase process and will see serum estrogen levels reduced. By far they are the most effective at combating gynecomastia and will have more success in combating water retention. In fact, SERM’s like Clomid often do very little to combat water retention. However, in many cases, many performance athletes would do a better job controlling water retention if they did a better job controlling their diet. In off-season bulking plans this requires excess calories to grow. However, many take it too far, especially carbohydrate consumptions, and this will cause you to hold water with or without anabolic steroid use. Add in aromatizing steroids to the equation and water retention will be even greater. Further, AI’s while effective will have a negative impact on cholesterol, which leads us to only one sane conclusion. Control your diet and if you can control gynecomastia with a SERM like Clomid it should be your first choice.

Then we’re left with the effects of Clomid as they pertain to PCT. When we supplement with anabolic steroids, this will suppress natural testosterone production. The rate of suppression will be dependent on the steroids being used and to a degree the total dosing, but it will generally be substantial. For this reason, most men will always include exogenous testosterone in their steroid cycles. In fact, it’s not uncommon for it to be the only steroid used. This will protect the individual from a low testosterone condition while on cycle. Unfortunately, once steroid use comes to an end natural testosterone levels will be very low. Natural testosterone production will begin again on its own, but it will take a significant amount of time for levels to reach their previous high state. In fact, total recovery can take months to even a year. Further, natural testosterone recovery is dependent on no prior low testosterone condition existing and assumes that no severe damage was done to the Hypothalamic-Pituitary-Testicular-Axis (HPTA) through improper anabolic steroid use.

Due to natural testosterone levels being low post cycle, most men are encouraged to implement a PCT program. This will stimulate natural testosterone production greatly and shorten the total recovery time. It will not return your levels to normal on its own; there is no PCT plan on earth that can do this. However, a solid PCT plan will ensure you have enough testosterone for proper bodily function while your levels continue to naturally rise. Clomid is an excellent choice for this purpose and one of the most commonly used PCT medications. Highly successful PCT programs will often include Clomid and Nolvadex as well as the powerful peptide hormone HCG (Human Chorionic Gonadotropin).

Those who forgo Clomid therapy post cycle or any type of PCT plan and are going to be off cycle for an extended period of time will rest in a low testosterone condition for an extended period of time. Not only is this an extremely unhealthy state, it can come with all the traditional low testosterone symptoms. Many will find cortisol levels greatly increase as testosterone levels are low, and as a result, body fat levels go up and strength and muscle mass decrease. If you’re going to be off cycle for an extended period of time, 8 weeks or more there is no reason for forgoing a PCT program. If you are going to be off cycle for less than 8 weeks or bridging with a low dose of exogenous testosterone, which is very common in hardcore bodybuilding circles, this is the only time a PCT would be counterproductive.
 

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Side Effects of Clomid:
Clomid is one of the most well-tolerated SERM’s and anti-estrogens on the market, and this applies to both men and women. While it carries a very high threshold of toleration, side effects of Clomid do exist and are possible. However, “possible” is the key word and a very important one. Anytime anabolic steroids are discussed as well as non-steroidal items used by anabolic steroid users, many seem to enjoy implying side effects are assured. This is not the case; in fact, most should be able to use Clomid side effect free.

When it comes to the possible side effects of Clomid, we will find most are fairly rare. Some women who have used the SERM as a fertility aid have experienced ovarian enlargement, but again this is very rare. Other possible side effects of Clomid use include:

  • Headaches
  • Nausea
  • Hot Flashes
  • Uterine Bleeding (extremely rare)
  • Breast Discomfort
The side effects of Clomid are also well noted for including possible visual disturbances. Data shows that approximately 1.5% of all those who use Clomid may experience some type of visual disturbance normally in the form of blurred or hazy vision. If this occurs, use should be discontinued and alternative medications should be examined. In most all cases, once use is discontinued vision will shortly return to normal. However, there have been a few reported cases over the years of visual disturbances that did not remedy post discontinuation. Normally, such cases have been linked to long term and extremely high dose use. Again, if visual disturbances occur, discontinue use immediately and choose another SERM to meet your needs.

A final note on the side effects of Clomid, some may experience acne. This appears to be most common when the SERM is used as part of a PCT program. In this case, it’s not really the SERM that’s causing the issue but rather the high influx of natural testosterone that is now being produced. Most should not have an issue, but those who are already genetically sensitive to acne may find a few pimples appear on their back, shoulders or chest.
 

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Clomid Administration:
For the purpose of fertility aid, Clomid doses will normally be at 50mg per day. The process is very simple; five days into the menstrual cycle a daily 50mg dose is administered every day once a day for five straight days. If this doesn’t result in conception, the dose is sometimes increased to 100mg per day. This cycle will be repeated 5-6 times over the course of the woman’s menstrual cycles until pregnant. If conception does not occur after 5-6 cycles of therapy, alternative treatments will need to be examined.

For the anabolic steroid user, standard Clomid doses for on cycle estrogenic protection will normally be 50mg per day throughout the duration of the cycle. If this doesn’t do the trick it’s unlikely any amount of Clomid will work. If this does not provide the protection you need, keep in mind many have reported greater success with the SERM Nolvadex for on cycle protection. However, you may very well need an AI like Arimidex.

Then we’re left with PCT Clomid use. Standard PCT Clomid doses will normally start at 100-150mg per day for 1-2 weeks. From here the dose will drop to 50-100mg per day for 1-2 weeks and finish with 1-2 weeks at 50mg per day. Total Clomid therapy should last 4-6 weeks, so dosing should be based and considered on that total schedule. Most will also be far more successful in their PCT recovery by including Nolvadex and HCG. Timing is also important when planning your Clomid PCT use, and this timing factor will vary depending on the inclusion of HCG:

  • If your cycle ends with any large ester base anabolic steroids, you will begin Clomid 2 weeks after your last injection.
  • If your cycle ends with all small ester base anabolic steroids, you will begin your Clomid 3 days after your last injection.
  • If your cycle ends with any large ester base anabolic steroids, you will begin HCG ten days after your last injection and begin Clomid after HCG therapy is complete.
  • If your cycle ends with all small ester base anabolic steroids, you will begin HCG 3 days after your last injection and begin Clomid after HCG therapy is complete.
Availability of Clomid:
Clomid is available worldwide on both the pharmaceutical and black markets. This is a very easy item to purchase, very affordable and should not be hard to find. In the U.S. it is not a controlled substance, but you will need a prescription to legally buy it. The exception would be a purchase through a research chemical lab (RCL). Numerous RCL’s have popped up over the years providing SERM’s, AI’s, peptides and a host of other items that are not controlled yet require a prescription. By providing such items in their liquid state and for research only, individuals can legally buy them without a prescription. It’s definitely a loophole in the law and it’s one that may not always be there, but it is for now. It is important, however, that you understand the purchase must be for research only. If law enforcement chose to make an issue over it and could prove your purchase was not for research you might find yourself in hot water. Beyond RCL’s, prescription Clomid is not too difficult to get and most black market steroid suppliers carry the SERM. However, if you make a purchase from a steroid supplier, even if you’re not actually buying steroids you will be breaking the law.
 

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Clomid Reviews:
Clomid is an excellent SERM and for years there has been an ongoing debate among anabolic steroid users as to which SERM is better, Clomid or Nolvadex. For the purpose of on cycle gynecomastia protection either one can work. Some have reported that Nolvadex tends to do a better job, but you may need to try both at different times to make an accurate assessment. Then we have PCT use, and both are equally effective and important. Many loudly claim Nolvadex is a far superior SERM for PCT purposes; however, there is a common problem with this statement. Most who use Clomid don’t use enough. On a milligram for milligram basis Nolvadex is stronger, so if you don’t plan a Clomid dose to match Nolvadex you’re going to be disappointed in the Clomid. Learn and understand the SERM’s and various items before you use them. Understand proper dosing protocols and you’ll get the most out of Clomid and any SERM you use.




Clomid Video




original.jpg

 

Waterproof

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Clomid was one of the original drugs used in post-cycle-therapy to stave off gynocomastia and raise the body’s natural testosterone levels. There are some side effects involved with heavy prolonged use, such as vision problems, and there are more effective substances on the market that do the same thing, but Clomid is still an effective and inexpensive compound for any athlete’s post-cycle-therapy.




Clomid can play a crucial role in preventing this crash in athletic performance


Clomid® is the commonly referenced brand name for the drug clomiphene citrate. It is not an anabolic steroid, but a prescription drug generally prescribed to women as a fertility aid. This is due to the fact that clomiphene citrate shows a pronounced ability to stimulate ovulation. This is accomplished by blocking/minimizing the effects of estrogen in the body. To be more specific Clomid is chemically a synthetic estrogen with both agonist/antagonist properties, and is very similar in structure and action to Nolvadex. In certain target tissues it can block the ability of estrogen to bind with its corresponding receptor. Its clinical use is therefore to oppose the negative feedback of estrogens on the hypothalamic-pituitary-ovarian axis, which enhances the release of LH and FSH. This of course can help to induce ovulation.
For athletic purposes, Clomid does not offer a tremendous benefit to women. In men however, the elevation in both follicle stimulating hormone and (primarily) luteinizing hormone will cause natural testosterone production to increase. This effect is especially beneficial to the athlete at the conclusion of a steroid cycle when endogenous testosterone levels are depressed. If endogenous testosterone levels are not brought beck to normal, a dramatic loss in size and strength is likely to occur once the anabolics have been removed. This is due to the fact that without testosterone (or other androgens), the catabolic hormone cortisol becomes the dominant force affecting muscle protein synthesis (quickly bringing about a catabolic metabolism). Often referred to as the post-steroid crash, it can quickly eat up much of your newly acquired muscle. Clomid can play a crucial role in preventing this crash in athletic performance. As for women, the only real use for Clomid is the possible management of endogenous estrogen levels near contest time. This can increase fat loss and muscularity, particularly in female trouble areas such as this hips and thighs. Clomid however often produces troubling side effects in women (discussed below), and is likewise not in very high demand among this group of athletes.

Male users generally find that a daily intake of 50-100 mg (1-2 tablets) over a four to six week period will bring testosterone production back to an acceptable level. A very common regime of dosing is; 300 md/day 1, 100 mg/day for days 2-11, and 50 mg/day for days 12-21. This raise in testosterone should occur slowly but evenly throughout the period of intake. Since an immediate boost in testosterone is often desirable, many prefer to combine Clomid with HCG (Human Chorionic Gonadotropin) for the first week or two after the steroids have been removed. The kick-start from HCG also helps to restore the normal ability for the testes to respond to endogenous LH, which may be hindered for some time after the cycle is ended due to a prolonged state of inactivity. Once the HCG is stopped, the user continues treatment with Clomid alone. HCG should not be used for longer than two or three weeks though, as the resulting increased testosterone and estrogen levels may again initiate negative feedback inhibition at the hypothalamus. When planning your ancillary drug program, it is also important to remember that injectable steroids can stay active for a long duration. Using ancillary drugs the first week after a long acting injectable like Sustanon has been stopped may prove to be wholly ineffective. Instead, the athlete should wait for two to three weeks, to a point where androgen levels will be diminishing. Here the body will be primed and ready to restore testosterone production.

Clomid and HCG are also occasionally used periodically during a steroid cycle, in an effort to prevent natural testosterone levels from diminishing. In many instances this practice can prove difficult however, especially when using strong androgens for longer periods of time. There is also no exact method for using the two drugs in this manner. Some have experimented by periodically administering small doses of HCG along with one or two tablets of Clomid, perhaps for a few days at a stretch followed by a longer break. An on/off schedule would be implemented; for fear that this combination may lose some effectiveness if used continuously for this purpose. This method of intake may prove to be effective, although it is really much more feasible to stimulate testosterone production after the cycle than to try and maintain it for the long duration during.

In addition to helping with the post-cycle testosterone crash, this drug can also help with elevated estrogen levels during a steroid cycle. A high estrogen bevel puts an athlete in serious risk of developing gynecomastia, which is an obvious unwanted side effect. With the intake of Clomid, the athlete can hopefully reduce his risk for developing gynecomastia. The estrogen “blocking” properties of Clomid appear to be slightly weaker than Nolvadex in comparison however, which is why it is not usually thought of as an equal substitute for estrogen maintenance. Of course both drugs have similar actions in the body. and are relatively interchangeable for this purpose. Clomid can likewise also be used as a maintenance anti-estrogen throughout the duration of steroid cycle with good confidence, just as is done with Nolvadex. In most instances this will prove equally sufficient, the drug effectively minimizing the activity of estrogen in the body and warding off gyno and excess water/fat retention. Unfortunately just as with Nolvadex this is not always the case however, and many find it necessary to addition another anti-estrogenic drug. The most common adjunct is Proviron, an oral DHT used to competitively lower aromatase activity and raise the androgen to estrogen ratio. The Clomid/Nolvadex and Proviron combination is extremely effective, although we could alternately replace them both with a more specific aromatase inhibitor such as Arimidex,Femara, or Aromasin. While stronger at combating estrogen in most cases, these drugs are also typically much more costly.

As for toxicity and side effects, Clomid is considered a very safe drug. Bodybuilders seldom report any problems, but listed possible side effects do include hot flashes, nausea, dizziness, headaches and temporarily blurred vision. Such side effects usually only appear in females however, as they feel the effects of estrogen manipulation much more readily than men. While female athletes can clearly gain some benefit from this substance, estrogen manipulation is probably not the most comfortable way to go about cutting up. Should it still be used for such purposed and side effects do become pronounced, the drug of course is to be discontinued and (at least) a break taken from it.

Clomiphene citrate is widely available on the black market in a variety of brand names as well as generic tabs and liquid versions.
 

ShenJingPoQi

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Are you going to run TEST with Deca and D-Bol? You should add Test so you won't shut down

That a great old school mass cycle, I'm running a Test E, Deca, D-Bol Cycle at the end of the year also

Consider subbing out the Primobolan and thinking about something like masteron for your sex drive

Either no test or keep test between 125-250mg? A lot of Classic era bodybuilders run cycles without test. So I think it's a non-issue.
 

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Either no test or keep test between 125-250mg? A lot of Classic era bodybuilders run cycles without test. So I think it's a non-issue.
Keep it at Maintenance bruh, 250. You have to remember Steroids really didn't hit the scene for bodybuilding around The 60's so they was still doing it on test and error and if you don't want to be shut down keep it at Maintenance level.

Test should always be a base for all cycles.You have to remember that all AS is a modified version of the male hormone(testosterone) even nandrolones like deca the just have the 19carbon removed(19-nors) and will surpress HPTA and shut down your natty test causing unwanted sides like libido issues,lethargy,and progesterone related sides as well.

This is a tryed and true mass builder cycle

test/deca/dbol

at a 2:1 ratio of test to deca you will have few sides related with nandrolones and have the best of both wolds-androgens & anabolic AAS
 

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(originally posted by AnimalMass)

While injecting test increases protein synthesis by roughly 50 times, depending on dose and time, most bodybuilders forget that it will reduce collagen synthesis by more than 50% -- more like 80%, giving you the collagen synthesis rate of a senior citizen. Since collagen makes up tendons, bros are very prone to injury if they continue to lift very heavy, unless they cycle off T and let their collagen synthesis get back to normal. It's like having the skeletal muscle of a gorilla with the tendons of a very old man.

Winstrol increases collagen synthesis. It will give you bigger tendons. However, your body compensates for this by making them more brittle, weaker, and more prone to injury. I can't tell you how many bros work out anaerobically and become injured while on winstrol. Guys who lift in the 1-5 rep range while on winstrol, to baseball players who sprint all out from a stationary position -- winstrol should be the LAST drug they choose. Most of them like winstrol because they don't get the weight gain from it but it is very detrimental to bros who train for any sport anaerobically. Tendons tear easily on it.

Also, the drugs I mention increase collagen synthesis while also increasing collagen cross-linking integrity, making for a much stronger tendon.

Winstrol, on the other hand, will dramatically increase collagen syn, but ironically it decreases collagen cross-linking integrity, thus making a much weaker tendon.

You can plan a cycle of AAS which will increase collagen synthesis and skeletal muscle growth at the same time. The key is the drug(s) you choose.

Deca, Equipoise, Anavar, and Primobolan will ALL increase skeletal muscle while at the same time dramatically increase collagen syn and bone mass and density, leaving you with a substantially reduced chance of becoming injured than if you choose to use AAS like sus, cyp, or enth.

While testosterone will increase bone mass and density, even at supra-physiological levels, the result is weaker tendons due to inhibition of collagen syn.

To plan a cycle where the goal is to increase skeletal muscle mass/strength while at the same time increase joint/tendon/ligament strength, enough to keep up with the dramatic increase in skeletal muscle, you must choose drugs like Eq, Deca, Anavar, or Primo as the base of your cycle. Testosterone and its esters can be added to your cycle to keep levels within a 'normal' physiological range (ie, 100-200 mg/wk) but must not go above this. Since drugs like eq, deca, anavar and primo will reduce endogenous, natural levels of test, these levels may be maintained with exogenous test in the 100-200 mg/wk range. Test at this dose will not inhibit collagen syn, but paradoxically, will help increase it. It is when exogenous testosterone is used > 200 mg/wk that collagen syn is inhibited.

Deca @ 3 mg/kg a week(about 270 mg/wk for a 200 lb male) will increase procollagen III levels by 270% by week 2. Procollagen III is a primary indicator used to determine the rate of collagen syn. As you can see, deca is a very good drug at giving you everything you want -- an increase in collagen syn, an increase in skeletal muscle, and increases in bone mass and density. The one thing it does not give you is wood.

Primobolan, @ 5 mg/kg, will increase collagen synthesis by roughly 180% -- less than deca and equipoise but still substantial.

Equipoise @ 3 mg/kg will increase procollagen III by approximately 340% -- slightly better than deca.

Oxandrolone has over a hundred studies documenting its effectiveness at treating patients needing rapid increases in collagen syn to enhance healing.

These drugs have longer half-lives than most other AAS, so this should be considered when timing your post cycle Clomid use. Here they are:

Deca: 15 days Equipoise: 14 days Primobolan: 10.5 days

Anavar has a half-life of only 8 hours so it should not pose a problem.

GH is probably the most remarkable drug at increasing collagen synthesis. It increases collagen syn in a dose dependant manner -- the more you use, the more you will increase collagen syn. It has also demonstrated this ability in short and long term studies. From what I've read, hGH at 6 iu/day increased the collagen deposition rate by around 250% in damaged collagen structures. This result indicates that the increased biomechanical strength of wounds to collagen structures treated with biosynthetic human growth hormone was produced by an increased deposition of collagen in the collagen structures.

Eq, primo, anavar, and deca are all good -- they increase several biomakers of collagen syn -- ie, type III, II, I, procollagen markers. GH just seems to do so most dramatically.

Use of any of these drugs @ supra-physiological levels with a maintenance dose of test will increase collagen syn while at the same time increase skeletal muscle mass. Skeletal muscle mass gains will not be as dramatic as with large testosterone doses but you have to weigh the risk/reward basis for yourself. Also, these drugs do not satisfy the libido like testosterone, but that is not the point of this thread. It is only to demonstrate that you can increase skeletal muscle and collagen syn at the same time with certain AAS -- the decision is up to you
.
 

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Finally joined the 315 club on my bench...I was stuck at 295 for so damn long messed around and got 3 reps for 315 this morning. My bench has always been week it seems especially since I prefer dumbell...

I think this is the NPP finally kicking in.
 

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Finally joined the 315 club on my bench...I was stuck at 295 for so damn long messed around and got 3 reps for 315 this morning. My bench has always been week it seems especially since I prefer dumbell...

I think this is the NPP finally kicking in.
Congratulations, keep banging that Bench that's only how you going to get stronger

I always stay with the barbell bench, I hit that first then go to dumbbells
 

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Week 8 ~ Test Sus 600mg Week
Week 4 ~ Tren E 400mg Week

Just pinned 300mg of Test Sust and 200mg in my right delt,
 

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Week 8 ~ Test Sus 600mg Week
Week 4 ~ Tren E 400mg Week

Just pinned 300mg of Test Sust and 200mg in my right delt,

I decided yesterday to start injecting the faster acting stuff into my delts and to use glutes for the long esters...I read that for fast acting stuff the delts are the best place to inject.

That water is all from the sus my breh that shyt has put some extra water weight on me as well.
 

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I decided yesterday to start injecting the faster acting stuff into my delts and to use glutes for the long esters...I read that for fast acting stuff the delts are the best place to inject.

That water is all from the sus my breh that shyt has put some extra water weight on me as well.

That Sus and Water retention is no joke, LMAO plus I'm taking creatine also, my face looks chubby as hell:lolbron:

Tren got me breathing like a fat boy:russ:

Yeah Bruh the Delts is the place for fast acting stuff.

This tendonitis is killing me, I think from now on EQ is going to be a staple of mines when I run gear, if I'm not running DECA, that article I posted was informative about how EQ, Deca, Anavar strengthen the ligaments
 
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