The “Islamic Dilemma” conversation on PIERS MORGAN?

DoubleClutch

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Westerners complaining about Islam is pretty funny.

Your governments have displaced millions of Muslims, killed hundreds of thousands of Muslims, armed Muslim terrorists in Syria and Mali and you believe you’re not the barbarians?

Complain as much as you want on the internet but there’s nothing you can do regarding Muslim growth demographics and Islam’s spread.

QUESTION:

how can you compare the evil acts done by mankind to ISLAM whose evil acts (slavery, rape, murder, theft, etc…) are interpreted as commanded by GOD verbatim?

We can judge man and say they are wrong based on our personal beliefs or shared moral code

Can you as a Muslim judge Allah or the QURAN?
 

2 Up 2 Down

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The crucifixion of Jesus is a historical fact. The resurrection obviously is one which can be questioned by non-Christians since that is the point of faith anyway.

But Islam made a big blunder denying a historical fact. Even sources outside of Christianity don't deny it. They don't call him devine...they just say he was a Jewish heretic who met his fate just like many heretics back in the day.
 

Nkrumah Was Right

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QUESTION:

how can you compare the evil acts done by mankind to ISLAM whose evil acts (slavery, rape, murder, theft, etc…) are interpreted as commanded by GOD verbatim?

We can judge man and say they are wrong based on our personal beliefs or shared moral code

Can you as a Muslim judge Allah or the QURAN?

Sounds like Christianity and Judaism to me.
 

merklman

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Now if opposing “child marriage” and domestic violence is what you call “fearing Islam”, Im guilty as charged. :hubie:


Sharing videos of Tommy Robinson? Who is a right wing islamophobic thug currently in jail for trying to crash a court case trying to convict paedophiles?

If you are consistent, do you fear religions which espouse the following:

Exodus 21:20-21 New International Version 20

“Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property."
How many slaves do you currently own, CAC? :scust:

Deuteronomy 22

New International Version​

Marriage Violations​

13 If a man takes a wife and, after sleeping with her, dislikes her 14 and slanders her and gives her a bad name, saying, “I married this woman, but when I approached her, I did not find proof of her virginity,” 15 then the young woman’s father and mother shall bring to the town elders at the gate proof that she was a virgin. 16 Her father will say to the elders, “I gave my daughter in marriage to this man, but he dislikes her. 17 Now he has slandered her and said, ‘I did not find your daughter to be a virgin.’ But here is the proof of my daughter’s virginity.” Then her parents shall display the cloth before the elders of the town, 18 and the elders shall take the man and punish him. 19 They shall fine him a hundred shekels[b] of silver and give them to the young woman’s father, because this man has given an Israelite virgin a bad name. She shall continue to be his wife; he must not divorce her as long as he lives.
20 If, however, the charge is true and no proof of the young woman’s virginity can be found, 21 she shall be brought to the door of her father’s house and there the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done an outrageous thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father’s house. You must purge the evil from among you.
22 If a man is found sleeping with another man’s wife, both the man who slept with her and the woman must die. You must purge the evil from Israel.
23 If a man happens to meet in a town a virgin pledged to be married and he sleeps with her, 24 you shall take both of them to the gate of that town and stone them to death—the young woman because she was in a town and did not scream for help, and the man because he violated another man’s wife. You must purge the evil from among you.
25 But if out in the country a man happens to meet a young woman pledged to be married and rapes her, only the man who has done this shall die. 26 Do nothing to the woman; she has committed no sin deserving death. This case is like that of someone who attacks and murders a neighbor, 27 for the man found the young woman out in the country, and though the betrothed woman screamed, there was no one to rescue her.
28 If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, 29 he shall pay her father fifty shekels[c] of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.

@DoubleClutch out here showing the town folk his daughters panties to prove she's a virgin:hubie:, and if she isnt a virgin, he's joining in with the townfolk stoning her to death :scust:


In other news, @DoubleClutch also out here raping females and paying the 50 shekel fine (but only if he's caught raping, otherwise he's :shaq:)


This is just one verse of the Bible, folks. You really dont want to keep digging, @DoubleClutch might be on suicide watch
 

DoubleClutch

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Sharing videos of Tommy Robinson? Who is a right wing islamophobic thug currently in jail for trying to crash a court case trying to convict paedophiles?

If you are consistent, do you fear religions which espouse the following:

Exodus 21:20-21 New International Version 20

“Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property."
How many slaves do you currently own, CAC? :scust:



@DoubleClutch out here showing the town folk his daughters panties to prove she's a virgin:hubie:, and if she isnt a virgin, he's joining in with the townfolk stoning her to death :scust:


In other news, @DoubleClutch also out here raping females and paying the 50 shekel fine (but only if he's caught raping, otherwise he's :shaq:)


This is just one verse of the Bible, folks. You really dont want to keep digging, @DoubleClutch might be on suicide watch

I follow and judge by the INJEEL just as the writers of the Quran understood and suggested Christians to do.

The “INJEEL” isn’t for you clearly. Otherwise you’d be a Christian right now. (But there’s still hope for you i believe) :manny:

You can’t find any fault in the INJEEL because you can’t even tell me what it is or what it says to even judge it against anything.

Based on what “Allah has revealed” to me via his “WORD”, I can look back (if I need to) and understand all previous scriptures and discern their deeper meanings and purposes hidden within the narrative.

You can’t do this because you are Muslim by choice. You might have faith in 1 GOD, but you follow a religion (Muhammadism) that offers a surface level understanding of scriptures which encourages no relationship with God other than a slave/master.

God isn’t your “Father” so you can’t learn any thing from him.

All you can do is trust in Muhammad and try to be obedient to the words attributed to him in the Quran which will get you nowhere because even in the Quran Muhammad never claimed to be the “son of God” or a “prophet” but just “Warner”.

Sahih International: Say, "I am not something original among the messengers, nor do I know what will be done with me or with you. I only follow that which is revealed to me, and I am not but a clear warner."


Keep praying 5 times a day, fasting, doing Hajj, kissing a rock and following the script like a robot.

It’s all “Allahs plan” written for you after all…. isn’t it? :youngsabo:
 

merklman

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I follow and judge by the INJEEL just as the writers of the Quran understood and suggested Christians to do.

The “INJEEL” isn’t for you clearly. Otherwise you’d be a Christian right now. (But there’s still hope for you i believe) :manny:

You can’t find any fault in the INJEEL because you can’t even tell me what it is or what it says to even judge it against anything.

Based on what “Allah has revealed” to me via his “WORD”, I can look back (if I need to) and understand all previous scriptures and discern their deeper meanings and purposes hidden within the narrative.

You can’t do this because you are Muslim by choice. You might have faith in 1 GOD, but you follow a religion (Muhammadism) that offers a surface level understanding of scriptures which encourages no relationship with God other than a slave/master.

God isn’t your “Father” so you can’t learn any thing from him.

All you can do is trust in Muhammad and try to be obedient to the words attributed to him in the Quran which will get you nowhere because even in the Quran Muhammad never claimed to be the “son of God” or a “prophet” but just “Warner”.

Sahih International: Say, "I am not something original among the messengers, nor do I know what will be done with me or with you. I only follow that which is revealed to me, and I am not but a clear warner."


Keep praying 5 times a day, fasting, doing Hajj, kissing a rock and following the script like a robot.

It’s all “Allahs plan” written for you after all…. isn’t it? :youngsabo:
I see how you completely avoided the words of your bible I quoted - why CAC? Too busy showing the Townfolk your daughters panties, and stoning girls to death? Or are you too busy raping people?

I can guarentee you have never read the Injeel, and never will :lolbron:you will squirm away from this argument because you know which question is coming next . . The same one you avoided answering 50 times in the other thread
Stop deflecting :mjgrin:
 

DoubleClutch

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Too busy showing the Townfolk your daughters panties, and stoning girls to death? Or are you too busy raping people?
Mental illness :what:

Coli Christians let’s all say a prayer for this Breh.

He’s completely lost it. :ohhh:
I think this thread pushed him over the edge as Wes Huff videos often do to Muslims :manny:
 

Hov

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Wow, this thread went four pages and no one even attempted to explain the INJEEL? :heh:

I mean, it’s a tough point for the Islamic faith but I never seen it just totally avoided lol.

They say the worst thing to ever happen to Islam is the internet.

Wait until yall find out about:

Khadija, a Christian women, being the actual start to Muhammad becoming a prophet (she sat him on her knee and made him believe)

Muhammad marrying a 4 year old and consummating at 9

Muhammad being demon possessed for 30 days and making his ppl worship 4 false idol structures while hallucinating

The fact the Quran stands on never being altered or changed in anyway and if so not true word of God…but the ones in the temples over seas have alterations

And…this is all in the Muslim texts & scripture, this isn’t outsider additions. But like humans do, most don’t read “that far”
 

merklman

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Mental illness :what:

Coli Christians let’s all say a prayer for this Breh.

He’s completely lost it. :ohhh:
I think this thread pushed him over the edge as Wes Huff videos often do to Muslims :manny:

I am quoting your scripture- stop deflecting and speak on it you sick freak :lolbron:

Deuteronomy 22

New International Version​

Marriage Violations​

13 If a man takes a wife and, after sleeping with her, dislikes her 14 and slanders her and gives her a bad name, saying, “I married this woman, but when I approached her, I did not find proof of her virginity,” 15 then the young woman’s father and mother shall bring to the town elders at the gate proof that she was a virgin. 16 Her father will say to the elders, “I gave my daughter in marriage to this man, but he dislikes her. 17 Now he has slandered her and said, ‘I did not find your daughter to be a virgin.’ But here is the proof of my daughter’s virginity.” Then her parents shall display the cloth before the elders of the town, 18 and the elders shall take the man and punish him. 19 They shall fine him a hundred shekels[b] of silver and give them to the young woman’s father, because this man has given an Israelite virgin a bad name. She shall continue to be his wife; he must not divorce her as long as he lives.
20 If, however, the charge is true and no proof of the young woman’s virginity can be found, 21 she shall be brought to the door of her father’s house and there the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done an outrageous thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father’s house. You must purge the evil from among you.
22 If a man is found sleeping with another man’s wife, both the man who slept with her and the woman must die. You must purge the evil from Israel.
23 If a man happens to meet in a town a virgin pledged to be married and he sleeps with her, 24 you shall take both of them to the gate of that town and stone them to death—the young woman because she was in a town and did not scream for help, and the man because he violated another man’s wife. You must purge the evil from among you.
25 But if out in the country a man happens to meet a young woman pledged to be married and rapes her, only the man who has done this shall die. 26 Do nothing to the woman; she has committed no sin deserving death. This case is like that of someone who attacks and murders a neighbor, 27 for the man found the young woman out in the country, and though the betrothed woman screamed, there was no one to rescue her.
28 If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, 29 he shall pay her father fifty shekels[c] of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.
 

Hov

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I am quoting your scripture- stop deflecting and speak on it you sick freak :lolbron:

Deuteronomy 22​

New International Version​

Marriage Violations​

13 If a man takes a wife and, after sleeping with her, dislikes her 14 and slanders her and gives her a bad name, saying, “I married this woman, but when I approached her, I did not find proof of her virginity,” 15 then the young woman’s father and mother shall bring to the town elders at the gate proof that she was a virgin. 16 Her father will say to the elders, “I gave my daughter in marriage to this man, but he dislikes her. 17 Now he has slandered her and said, ‘I did not find your daughter to be a virgin.’ But here is the proof of my daughter’s virginity.” Then her parents shall display the cloth before the elders of the town, 18 and the elders shall take the man and punish him. 19 They shall fine him a hundred shekels[b] of silver and give them to the young woman’s father, because this man has given an Israelite virgin a bad name. She shall continue to be his wife; he must not divorce her as long as he lives.
20 If, however, the charge is true and no proof of the young woman’s virginity can be found, 21 she shall be brought to the door of her father’s house and there the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done an outrageous thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father’s house. You must purge the evil from among you.
22 If a man is found sleeping with another man’s wife, both the man who slept with her and the woman must die. You must purge the evil from Israel.
23 If a man happens to meet in a town a virgin pledged to be married and he sleeps with her, 24 you shall take both of them to the gate of that town and stone them to death—the young woman because she was in a town and did not scream for help, and the man because he violated another man’s wife. You must purge the evil from among you.
25 But if out in the country a man happens to meet a young woman pledged to be married and rapes her, only the man who has done this shall die. 26 Do nothing to the woman; she has committed no sin deserving death. This case is like that of someone who attacks and murders a neighbor, 27 for the man found the young woman out in the country, and though the betrothed woman screamed, there was no one to rescue her.
28 If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, 29 he shall pay her father fifty shekels[c] of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.
Here you go G:

The passage is part of the Mosaic Law given to ancient Israel under their theocratic system, not modern moral law or Christian doctrine.
• Verses 13–21 deal with false accusations against a bride. If the accusation is false, the man is fined and must stay married to her. If the accusation is true and she was sexually immoral while in her father's house, she was stoned...not for lack of virginity, but for deceit and bringing shame to her father's household.
• Verse 22 condemns adultery. Both parties die, consistent with Leviticus 20:10.
• Verses 23–24 address consensual sex with a betrothed woman in town, both are guilty if she did not cry for help.
Verses 25–27 clarify that rape in the countryside is not the woman’s fault and only the man dies.
Verses 28–29 refer to premarital sex (not rape, in the Hebrew) with an unbetrothed virgin. The verb used is taphas (seize) and shakab (lie with), often interpreted as seduction or force without her being pledged. The punishment is financial and obligates marriage meant to protect the woman from abandonment in a patriarchal society.

This does not apply to modern Christian ethics, these were civil laws for ancient Israel not prescriptions for Christian practice.

Jesus fulfilled the Law (Matthew 5:17), and the New Covenant does not mandate these punishments.
 

DoubleClutch

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Here you go G:

The passage is part of the Mosaic Law given to ancient Israel under their theocratic system, not modern moral law or Christian doctrine.
• Verses 13–21 deal with false accusations against a bride. If the accusation is false, the man is fined and must stay married to her. If the accusation is true and she was sexually immoral while in her father's house, she was stoned...not for lack of virginity, but for deceit and bringing shame to her father's household.
• Verse 22 condemns adultery. Both parties die, consistent with Leviticus 20:10.
• Verses 23–24 address consensual sex with a betrothed woman in town, both are guilty if she did not cry for help.
Verses 25–27 clarify that rape in the countryside is not the woman’s fault and only the man dies.
Verses 28–29 refer to premarital sex (not rape, in the Hebrew) with an unbetrothed virgin. The verb used is taphas (seize) and shakab (lie with), often interpreted as seduction or force without her being pledged. The punishment is financial and obligates marriage meant to protect the woman from abandonment in a patriarchal society.

This does not apply to modern Christian ethics, these were civil laws for ancient Israel not prescriptions for Christian practice.

Jesus fulfilled the Law (Matthew 5:17), and the New Covenant does not mandate these punishments.
Good response but don’t bother with him. I’ve said everything that needs to be said in multiple posts In different threads throughout the year

He’s hardened and stubborn. He won’t understand because he doesn’t believe in Jesus.

He can try those arguments against Jews I guess. Not sure why he keeps mentioning the Torah laws and old stories to me :mjlol:

Don’t play the “whataboutism” game with him.


No matter how good your response, he will just read your post, give some stupid responses with personal insults and deflect to some other dawah script talking point which IS NOT RELATED TO THE THREAD TOPIC


All Muslims do this to avoid criticism of their religion, prophet and book.

Let’s get back to the Islamic dilemma



and debunking the religion like in this video below

 
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