The Government does a good job redistributing income

Ezra

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I'm a MMT advocate. But that's it's going to take at least 30 more years until we get to that point, imo. There has to be a cultural change in how we view government spending.

Anyway...I wouldn't say that the tax revenue doesn't fund the federal government. It does.
Yes we're still a ways away from that cultural shift in the masses understanding how government spending works.

Although most of congress operates as if taxes fund the federal gov, making it effectively true, it is still an arbitrary and fake limit they place upon themselves. Tax revenue 100% does not fund the federal government.
 

Secure Da Bag

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Read The Deficit Myth by Stephanie Kelton.Or if you don't wanna read, youtube her or MMT. Basically it's how Ezra's post says below.

Why are you quoting me? I explicitly said that "I don't disagree". But the poster has a bit of a reputation. So posting a link with his post would have mitigated the naysayers and haters.
 

OfTheCross

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Keeping my overhead low, and my understand high
Yes we're still a ways away from that cultural shift in the masses understanding how government spending works.

Although most of congress operates as if taxes fund the federal gov, making it effectively true, it is still an arbitrary and fake limit they place upon themselves. Tax revenue 100% does not fund the federal government.


You've admitted that it effectively does. Can the government run without it? Yes. But it doesn't operate that way.

That's why the premise of the thread is based on our current reality. How can we do things that cost money currently?

Is China the only country using MMT at the moment?

I assume they are because no one believes any of the economic data that comes outta there...
 

inndaskKy

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I'm a MMT advocate. But that's it's going to take at least 30 more years until we get to that point, imo. There has to be a cultural change in how we view government spending.

Anyway...I wouldn't say that the tax revenue doesn't fund the federal government. It does.

It really doesn't. It's just PR.

You've admitted that it effectively does. Can the government run without it? Yes. But it doesn't operate that way.

That's why the premise of the thread is based on our current reality. How can we do things that cost money currently?

Is China the only country using MMT at the moment?

I assume they are because no one believes any of the economic data that comes outta there...

The executive spending part of government does. The taxation part is just politics and not really relevant to the question what the economic options are. Playing along with politics because 'that's just how the game works' will lead us all nowhere.
 

Ezra

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You've admitted that it effectively does. Can the government run without it? Yes. But it doesn't operate that way.

That's why the premise of the thread is based on our current reality. How can we do things that cost money currently?

Is China the only country using MMT at the moment?

I assume they are because no one believes any of the economic data that comes outta there...

No country 'uses' MMT. MMT is just an analysis of how economies operate. When I said thats how it functionally works now, I meant it as it's used as an excuse as why we cant do shyt. Even though we act like we dont 'use' MMT, we absolutely use MMT in the USA


You have traditional Austrian and Chicago School philosophies that say you must treat fiscal policy like a household. If you spend too much you'll go into debt, and default. People will lose faith in the currency that will lead to inflation or staglfation.

You have the Keynesian philosophy that says you can over spend, but you need to do it when rates are low and, you need to lower taxes to stimulate the economy, you need to keep a certain level of unemployment that will keep inflation in check by keeping a certain part of the work force from earning money and spending it into the economy.

Weve seen all kinds of evidence that the Chicago School philosophy is trash, and just neo con babble to keep the power in the hands of who currently holds it. If Classical/Chicago economics were correct, we'd be in tailspin due to size of our national debt. If anyone quotes Milton Friedman or Thomas Sewell, they're doing you a favor by letting you know you dont need to hear their opinion on anything.

We've also seen evidence that Keynesian aint right either. It was thought that 8% unemployment was the threshold to keep inflation in check. UE has been as low as 3% and nothing. Before COVID, we should have been seeing huge inflation. Borrowed a ton of money, taxes were dropped very low, unemployment was as low as it has been in forever. No inflation.


MMT is the analysis that explains why we havent seen the adverse effects we would be seeing if these other theories were true. . We spend way more than we bring in w taxes, we have growing national 'debt' (it's not really debt) taxation is very low historically, spending his very high, unemployment was very low pre covid. We should be in a great depression, but we're not.

The fact is we DO operate under MMT principles regardless of if our leaders realize it or admit it. It's the reason why we can spend so much, tax so little, and grow a huge debt (it's not debt)

The reason MMT is viewed as progressive thing is that people have realized - Hey spend all this money on the military, and bunch of bullshyt that just ends up in corporate hands, and nothign is happening to the economy that should be if what we've all been told is true. Instead of spending on Bullshyt, lets use MMT principles to make arguments for how we can make economy work better for everyone and dismiss the 'how you gonna pay for it' excuse whenever people want better healthcare, education, infrastructure, address homelessness -whatever. But never ask how we're gonna pay for spending into the military complex, tax cuts ect.
 
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