THE CULTURE : DEBUNK BUSTA RHYMES AND PETE ROCK'S OUTRAGEOUS COMMENTS

[tuckgod]

Watched the 1st few minutes and I fukks with this.

Gonna finish later.

We waking up...

 

[Cadillac]

Didn't we already destroy that misinformation like a couple weeks ago?​

yes, but the "jamaica made hip hop" narrative is a popular origin story that its still being regurgitated outside this site.

Jay Z had a whole music video tributing to jamaica as "the place where hip hop was made"

 

[Dafunkdoc_Unlimited]

yes, but the "jamaica made hip hop" narrative is a popular origin story that its still being regurgitated outside this site.

Jay Z had a whole music video tributing to jamaica as "the place where hip hop was made"

We've known that was nonsense for years. Jamaicans were influenced by American pop/soul, not the other way around. Hip-hop culture started in America as a response to disco culture.

Word to Grandmaster Flowers.​

 

[Cadillac]

We've known that was nonsense for years. Jamaicans were influenced by American pop/soul, not the other way around. Hip-hop started in America as a response to disco.

Word to Grandmaster Flowers.​

yes, but that doesnt matter because the popular narrative is that jamaicans made it

its why busta and pete rock are out here talkin about hip hop is jamaican culture.

and you got jamacians talking shyt like on twitter that they are the reason for hip hop

 

[IllmaticDelta]

The thread that started it all


https://www.thecoli.com/threads/fac...rom-da-bronx-they-was-pimps-down-south.62884/

 

[IllmaticDelta]

time stamp: This is practically word for word what I've been saying for years. These younger jamaicans (even ones born as far back as the 1960s) have no grasp of their own history so it causes them to make bold statements that are ahistorical in regards to the history of the music on their island and what they think they own/birthed in USA hiphop. I've said numerous times to listen to the TRUE Jamaican pioneers (people born back as far as the 1930s) of Ska/Rocksteady/Reggae because they are the ones that set the stage for dancehall/deejay/selector culture in Jamaica and will openly explain/admit where toasting came from, the differences between their 1 turntable selector culture vs Afram 2 turntable disco culture. These 60's, 70's and 80's babies likes KRS, Pete Rock and Busta grew up on the Herc myth so they took it as 100% fact w/o realizing that Herc himself numerous times flat out denied the connection between Jamaica and HipHop. People kept saying Rapping came from Jamaican toasting via Coke La Roc-the man who who Herc himself credited as the first MC




isn't Jamaican but an afram of North Carolinian heritage




but someone/people (read any oldschool/early hiphop history article or book) were putting out that Coka La Roc was jamaican to fit the narrative/mythical Jamaican origin of hiphop

and it went unchecked because no one was interviewing any of the first generation hiphop pioneers outside of Herc (baam and flash aren't first generation hiphop)

but NOW we have the internet/modern ways to inform people on/about hiphop history and many of the pioneers lost to the Herc/Jamaican myth are being mentioned and interviewed so we can now see the full scope of how HipHop was born and what was its actual roots



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another myth that's been debunked. herc wasn't even the first to do it on his side of the Bronx. Even people that eventually ran with herc said hiphop was being done even on herc side of town before they even heard of herc

read below (this is the west bron, herc's hood)


dj smoke had bboys and he was around the same time as herc (actually before...many of the bboys we associate with herc were with smokey first!)

“Herc had the recognition, he was the big name in the Bronx back then”, explains AJ. “Back then the guys with the big names were: Kool D, Disco King Mario, Smokey and the Smoke-a-trons, Pete DJ Jones, Grandmaster Flowers and Kool Herc. Not even Bambaataa had a big name at that time, you know what I’m sayin?”

Ill-literature with Skillz to Blaze: One Night At the Executive Playhouse

^^the ones I bolded in blue are all before herc. Dj Smoke is from the same time and area as herc. More on him and his dance crew

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melle mel mentions him as the first person he saw doing hiphop in the west bronx




now, here goes an OG bboy who was part of herc's team who said he was bboying way before he heard of herc and was down with dj dmoke first!

Clark Kent:

NORIN RAD:"What was your relationship with the legendary (N***er) Twins?"

CLARK KENT:"Well, we met when we were 8 years old and we did everything together in the beginning of hiphop. If you saw me, you saw the Twins...if you saw the Twins, you saw me..our names were cemented together, okay?! There's nothing that they were involved in that I wasn't there for and there is nothing that I was involved in that they wasn't there for. We were like triplets. Wherever you seen one you seen all three of us when it came to movin' around in Hiphop. We used to travel down to Chuck Center which is one of the places we really honed our skills at before finding out about Kool Herc and going to Kool Herc's parties. We would go to Chuck Center like every other week 'cause they had a dance contest and we used to love winning that dance contest."

NORIN RAD:"That's some precious knowledge!!! Chuck Center was located in East Harlem, right?"

CLARK KENT: "Yes on 115th Street & 2nd Avenue."

NORIN RAD: "So you were basically breaking at Chuck Center BEFORE you met Kool Herc?"

CLARK KENT:"Before I even met Kool Herc! That's where The (N***er) Twins and I honed our skills and we would go down there with cats like Wallace Dee and Chip. These are guys from the era of like Trixie and them. We ran with a whole host of cats down there before we found out what Herc was doing what he was doing on the Westside (of the Bronx).One of the names I wanna mention though is Dancing Doug!!!Back then Chuck Center was one of the places where we encountered Dancing Doug! The premier place to do breaking became Kool Herc's parties but prior to Kool Herc's we used to go to (DJ) Smokey's parties, you know, the Twins and I. From Smokey's we caught on to Chuck Center and then from Chuck Center we caught on to what Herc was doing. And out of all the places we went, you know, we honed our skills! A lot of people have this misconception that we got our skills at Kool Herc's...by the time the Twins and I arrived at Kool Herc's we was already elite!!!!

Castles In The Sky

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now the man himself, Dj Smokey

NORIN RAD:"What made you pick up that name Smokey?"

DJ SMOKEY:DJ Smokey! As time went on I dropped the Y and it was DJ Smoke. People just kept calling me DJ Smokey. Flash and them would call me DJ Smokey. Kool Herc called me DJ Smokey."


NORIN RAD: "When did you form your dance crew? The Smoke-A-Trons? Was that around 1974/75?"

DJ SMOKEY: "No. That was around 1972."

NORIN RAD: "From your recollection how did Breaking as a dance come about? What are its roots?"

DJ SMOKEY: " Okay, in 1969 the dance at these 25 Cent parties in the basements and in the clubs started to change, it was more of a expression vibe. Like this song that came out in 1970 "Express Yourself!" You see it was more of a rush dance, a anger dance. "Say It Loud I'm Black And I'm Proud" ..they were like "Ahhhh, I'm angry!" A anger dance!! Like "I'm tired of all this shyt....who you're calling ******?" and it was also like "I'm from this block you're from that block!" You know what I'm saying? Two guys would go at each other....




NORIN RAD: "So the Smoke-A-Tron B-Boys and B-Girls were Sista Boo, Johnny Kool, James Bond, Crazy Eddie.."

DJ SMOKEY:"Yes, but I had more. there were bout 20 of them."

NORIN RAD: "Could you name them please?"

DJ SMOKEY: "El Dorado Mike."

NORIN RAD: "El Dorado Mike was down with you, too? I have heard a lot about him...."

DJ SMOKEY: "Yeah, he was one my B-Boys. The ****** Twins would come to my parties, too. You can ask them about me, you can ask them about DJ Smokey...Then I had Bo Bo, he was from the 9. Here's another one: The Calgonite Kid. He was so dirty that they called him the Calgonite Kid. Then there was Barbara, Beavey, Born, Knowledge...They are in heaven now."

NORIN RAD: "What about Ron, Sleepy and Kaseem? I heard Pow Wow from the Zulu Kings mention them as great B-Boys."'

DJ SMOKEY: "Yes, yes they were all Smoke-A-Trons. Sleepy was very good."

NORIN RAD:"What were your stomping grounds in terms of indoor as well as outdoor party spots around the early to mid 1970 when The Smoke-A-Trons were with you?"

DJ SMOKEY:"The Cave! '74! It was on Webster Avenue....in the Webster Avenue Projects. It was on Webster Avenue & 167th street. We called it The Cave."

NORIN RAD:"Damn! Melle Mel mentioned that the first B-Boy party he ever witnessed took place at The Cave with you playing the music....Was that a club?"

DJ SMOKEY:"It was a community center. One of the buildings had a big community center and it was in that center!"

NORIN RAD:"I heard that you were also giving parties at a spot called Over The Dover (I read that in an interview with Pow Wow from the Zulu Kings / Soul Sonic Force)....What kind of spot was that?"



NORIN RAD:" From what I've heard you also used to do parties at your apartment on Grant Avenue where B-Boys got down at heavily..."

DJ SMOKEY:" Yes!! All day long!!! All day long!!! My apartment was on 169th street & Grant Avenue...5D!!! On the fifth floor....We played music 24/7 !! That's where my Smoke-A-Trons..they would come in there daily, hang out and dance. We would also do block parties on Grant Avenue in the summer time."

Castles In The Sky

and this from jdl or melle mel on smokey (don't have the book)

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Almighty KG from Cold Crush



recent interview (he's from herc's area)

NORIN RAD:"Most people probably know you for your great contributions to the Hiphop element of MCing as a legendary member of the Cold Crush Four MCees but as you told me you were once also a B-Boy. So when and where did you witness Breaking for the very first time?"

ALMIGHTY KG:"Well, I first witnessed Breaking in about 1971 at a DJ Smokey & The Master Plan Bunch party on Grant Avenue. I saw this guy named Crip and the original Mr. Freeze breakdancing and that's kinda like when I caught the bug right there....breakdancing. "




NORIN RAD:"Most people today have a certain image of what Breaking looks like in their mind but could you elaborate please on how the dance looked like when you first saw it?"

ALMIGHTY KG:"When I saw these guys breakdancing which was The Smoke-A-Trons and The Luke-A-Trons.......but you know The Smoke-A-Trons they would do something I had never seen before and that I have never seen since. They were all like gymnastics and they would do somersaults and Arabian Nights..those are like flips you see in the olympics... and go down on the floor and all that. I never passed that test to do the flipping....because I wasn't a gymnast but these guys were like street gymnasts and they were like really good...You know how you see like sometimes B-Boys they do a B-Boy move and then they go down on the ground...these guys were doing that with flips and stuff like that!! It was incredible....it was so incredible so that's what I wanted to do 'cause I was too young to buy equipment (for DJing) and Graffiti...

Castles In The Sky: August 2018


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Pow Wow from Soul Sonic Force/Zulu Nation



his thoughts

Well, when did you guys decide that, from the Zulu Kings and all, that you three and Bambaataa were going to be The Soulsonic Force, more as a music group?

So it wound up just being us three that stuck it out. 'Cause me and G.L.O.B.E. were more in the hip-hop area than the Bronx River was. See, where we came from, we were hip-hop, with The L Brothers, DJ Smokey and the Smokeatron, he was from Grand Avenue. And a lot of guys, they don't talk about him. I'll get back to what we were saying, but DJ Smokey, and his brother Roscoe and the Smokeatron, they were the baddest motherfukkers out at the time, man. I mean, Flash couldn't touch them, Kool Herc couldn't touch them. Nobody was touchin' Smokey. And a lot of cats will not speak on him, which they should, because he is also a pioneer of hip-hop music.

And what happened to him?

I heard he moved out of state. I heard he moved before hip-hop music turned big. I guess he cut it loose and went about his life, but DJ Smokey and his brother Roscoe, let me tell you, they threw the baddest parties. You wanted to see some guys that could dance? Man, it was a show! There's a movie theatre we had over on 174th St in the Bronx River called The Dover movie theatre that had a place you could give parties - it's a church now - but he made that spot very popular. He used to throw block parties mostly on Grand Avenue. And this guy here, I wanna let the world know about him; he definitely deserves his props, man, because he was there in the beginning. And a lot of guys don't that brother his recognition, which is sad; and I'ma give it to him every time all the time

Werner von Wallenrod's Humble, Little Hip-Hop Blog: Be What You Be - Pow Wow Interview (Soulsonic part 1)

 

[truth2you]

@IllmaticDelta you stay blessing us

I wanted to know about dj smoke after hearing green eyed genie talk about him, and you did it

FOREVER GRATEFUL