The 2024 Baltimore Ravens thread

[EzekelRAGE]

Seems like a lot of words just to say "we wasted resources in acquiring him"

 

[Blessings]

The browns loss would’ve been a win too because if Tucker made his kick earlier then they could’ve kicked an easy field goal to win it instead of needing a touchdown.


This is why I tend to ignore any criticism of Lamar. He’s basically gotta win games with no head coach and half the time with no OC either, which is just not feasible at the pro level.


They’ve got 3 offensive linemen this year among the top 10 most flagged players in the entire league. Any quarterback but Lamar and this line would be giving up 2006 raiders type sack numbers on the year. He’s running for his life nearly every drop back these days.

National media focus on the wrong things:
-Lamar - despite being Superman not doing enough when there's no other QB that can operate at a high level with this coaching staff and offensive line
-Derrick Henry's lack of carries lol
-Harbaugh is an elite coach lol
-Pass defense - significant improvement in the last few games


They should be focusing on the talking points you mentioned
-Justin Tucker missing field goals and extra points
-Offensive line penalties
-Offensive line playing like shyt (insane amount of pressure allowed, Lamar doing more blocking than dudes on the line smh)
-Predictable on offense
-Special Teams (Gave up 2 onside recoveries)
-Penalties (most penalized team)


Ravens get away with mediocrity at the coaching level because local media doesn't want to lose access, and national media doesn't watch the actual games to provide an objective analysis.

 

[Mantis Toboggan M.D.]

Makes you wonder if dudes are actually coaching or Lamar + Justin Tucker do not take coaching well

The ravens issues date back to when Lamar was in middle school and Tucker was in high school. Some of us have been pointing the problems this team has had since George bush was president and before many of us could legally drink. The only guy who hasn’t been replaced since then is the cardboard cutout in a headset on the sideline.

You speaking FACTS


I'm getting upset again, because I know the coaches ain't gonna do shyt

This is the reason above all others I compare Harbaugh to Brian Cashman. He also doesn’t address a problem or even acknowledge it until it burns them for at least 2-3 years in a row. Remember the 2012 Sunday night game where he just stood there and let Brady pick on Cary Williams all game, throwing what had to be 12-13 passes at Williams? Remember him letting Cam Cameron sandbag the offense for 5 years? Remember him letting Dean Pees kneecap the defense for 6 years and was perfectly content to let him come back for a 7th year if he wanted before he chose to retire? Think about how after 7 years they still won’t invest any money at wide receiver. Think about how he still doesn’t get involved on offense or defense after nearly 20 years.

 

[Blessings]

The ravens issues date back to when Lamar was in middle school and Tucker was in high school. Some of us have been pointing the problems this team has had since George bush was president and before many of us could legally drink. The only guy who hasn’t been replaced since then is the cardboard cutout in a headset on the sideline.


This is the reason above all others I compare Harbaugh to Brian Cashman. He also doesn’t address a problem or even acknowledge it until it burns them for at least 2-3 years in a row. Remember the 2012 Sunday night game where he just stood there and let Brady pick on Cary Williams all game, throwing what had to be 12-13 passes at Williams? Remember him letting Cam Cameron sandbag the offense for 5 years? Remember him letting Dean Pees kneecap the defense for 6 years and was perfectly content to let him come back for a 7th year if he wanted before he chose to retire? Think about how after 7 years they still won’t invest any money at wide receiver. Think about how he still doesn’t get involved on offense or defense after nearly 20 years.

Last Manning Cast, and on Pat McCaffee's show Belichick was lowkey campaigning for Harbaugh's job.

It's simple fix
Harbaugh Out
Belichick In

 

[Blessings]

lol



hmmm

 

[Mantis Toboggan M.D.]

Last Manning Cast, and on Pat McCaffee's show Belichick was lowkey campaigning for Harbaugh's job.

It's simple fix
Harbaugh Out
Belichick In

I said this same thing as soon as the clock hit 00:00 on the afc title game. The ravens under Harbaugh consistently beat themselves more than any other good football team I’ve ever seen, while not beating yourself is the foundation of everything the hoodie does as a coach.

 

[Blessings]

1. Lamar Jackson’s production sets him apart among MVP candidates, but with two of his worst statistical games playing out in recent widely televised defeats, his candidacy has taken a hit.​

• Why Jackson tops my ballot now: The best MVP candidates are quarterbacks who carry their teams to victories despite poor support from their defenses and special teams. This is when the most valuable players (quarterbacks) are truly most valuable.

Patrick Mahomes carrying Kansas City to Super Bowl victories after the 2018 and 2022 seasons, when those Chiefs teams ranked 27th and 29th, respectively, in combined EPA on defense/special teams, is part of what sets him apart from other championship quarterbacks.

Jackson still must prove himself in the postseason, but the MVP is a regular-season award, and Jackson is doing what only MVP-caliber quarterbacks are able to do. The QB Betrayal Index published last month showed him leading the way in this measure of QB value, a big change for Baltimore, which once dominated on defense and special teams, making it easier to win.

With kicker Justin Tucker slumping and the defense still finding its footing, the Ravens rank 29th in combined EPA on defense and special teams, one spot ahead of Cincinnati. They are nonetheless 8-5 and projected to finish 11-6, per The Athletic’s model, because their offense ranks first in EPA overall and per play.

The Betrayal Index takes EPA associated with the quarterback, subtracts his team’s EPA on defense/special teams and then divides the total by games started. When QB EPA is highly positive and team defense/special teams EPA is highly negative, the number grows large.

Jackson’s 13-game Betrayal Index figure this season ranks third over the past decade among all QBs whose teams were at least three games above .500 at this point (see table below), per TruMedia.

QB Betrayal Index through 13 games, since 2015

QB	QB EPA	D/ST EPA	Betrayal/gm
2018 Mahomes (11-2)	187.1	-56.4	18.7
2022 Mahomes (10-3)	169.9	-66.6	18.2
2024 Jackson (8-5)	132.5	-61	14.9
2020 Rodgers (10-3)	140.2	-36.1	13.6
2016 Ryan (8-5)	129.6	-44.4	13.4

The other QBs in the top five — Mahomes in 2018 and 2022, Aaron Rodgers in 2020 and Matt Ryan in 2016 — all won MVP honors in those seasons. Whether MVP voters knew it or not, they were rewarding the quarterbacks whose brilliance helped overcome weaker support from their defenses and special teams. That is Jackson this season.

Ryan might be the best comp for Jackson because his Super Bowl-bound 2016 Falcons also started 8-5.

Jackson ranks among the NFL’s top three in EPA per pass play, passer rating, touchdown passes, passing yards and yards per attempt. The 132.5 EPA associated with his passes, rushes and scrambles leads the league by far. Allen is second among quarterbacks at 94.0, followed by Goff (86.4), Jayden Daniels (78.3) and Joe Burrow (73.2).

But as the chart below shows, Jackson’s production (measured by EPA) does not correlate with his MVP odds.


It would seem odd if Jackson missed out on MVP honors this season after almost lucking into the award last season, when there weren’t strong candidates. But team results remain such a big part of the equation, driving narratives. While the Betrayal Index tells us Jackson is actually more impressive this season, the elite defensive performance that drove Baltimore’s 13-4 record and top seeding in the AFC one year ago cast his 2023 candidacy in a more favorable light.

Jackson has gone from heavy MVP favorite to fourth behind Allen, Barkley and Goff after his Ravens lost two of their past three. Allen’s Bills have not lost since Oct. 6. Barkley’s Eagles and Goff’s Detroit Lions haven’t lost since September (Goff lags for me in MVP consideration because I think he does less than the others on his own). Jackson gets a bye this week before finishing with the Giants, Steelers, Texans and Browns. He needs a strong finish.

The chart below compares Jackson’s EPA through 13 games to the 13-game totals for every MVP winner since 2000, regardless of position. His production towers over his 2023 production while ranking high among previous winners.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5958013/2024/12/02/nfl-mvp-lamar-jackson-josh-allen-saquon-barkley/

 

[EzekelRAGE]

It would seem odd if Jackson missed out on MVP honors this season after almost lucking into the award last season, when there weren’t strong candidates. But team results remain such a big part of the equation,

Acho mentioned this around 2-4 weeks ago. Said he as an MVP voter would be giving his vote to Allen. He said Lamar's stats dont matter because his team is losing. Specifically brought up how last year Josh had the better stats but stuff went Lamar's way because of Baltimore's success. I think Acho was on some anti lamar shyt though because when he brought up Lamar's stats from last year he only mentioned 3400 yards. I know remember when arguing about Lamar vs Purdy last year that Lamar had like 4400 total yards. Another thing Acho was overlooking is while MVP talks were going on Lamar/Baltimore got wins against the other MVP candidates(Dak/Purdy/CMC iirc) which raised Lamar's stock.

Seems like everyone has forgot that Allen shyt the bed against the ravens. If that game happened later in this season, Josh probably wouldnt be over Lamar/Saquon/Goff.

 

[Mantis Toboggan M.D.]

Acho mentioned this around 2-4 weeks ago. Said he as an MVP voter would be giving his vote to Allen. He said Lamar's stats dont matter because his team is losing. Specifically brought up how last year Josh had the better stats but stuff went Lamar's way because of Baltimore's success. I think Acho was on some anti lamar shyt though because when he brought up Lamar's stats from last year he only mentioned 3400 yards. I know remember when arguing about Lamar vs Purdy last year that Lamar had like 4400 total yards. Another thing Acho was overlooking is while MVP talks were going on Lamar/Baltimore got wins against the other MVP candidates(Dak/Purdy/CMC iirc) which raised Lamar's stock.

Seems like everyone has forgot that Allen shyt the bed against the ravens. If that game happened later in this season, Josh probably wouldnt be over Lamar/Saquon/Goff.

There’s no consistent logic to the anti Lamar argument. He carries the ravens the same way Peyton Manning carried the colts. This is a 4-5 win team max without him. Look at 2021. They lose him down the stretch and drop 6 games in a row to end the year. Anti Lamar talk seems to get people talking about whatever talking head said the aforementioned dumb shyt, so they keep saying it. Any other quarterback is getting sacked 4-5 times a game behind this line and struggling to get their offense even into the red zone.

 

[premier58]

@Blessings Mahomes didnt win a Superbowl after the 2018 season.

 

[mr heyzel]

Its not all on Moken, Lamar has to be better also

there were plays where Likely was open underneath and Lamar chosse to throw a deep pass to Agholor instead

thats just dumb

Mahomes isn’t gonna pass up Kelce to throw a deep pass to Mecole Hardman

Even Zay was frustrated because Lamar wasn’t looking for him when he was wide open on a crucial 3rd down

There were also several running lanes Lamar passed up just to throw an incompletion

Yes Mokens gameplan was ass but Lamar didn’t play well at all

He has to be better and make better decisions

He played good enough to win not I’m expecting a stellar performance every week but he had this team in position to put up points on the board and the chicken man didn’t come through

 

[mr heyzel]

Lamar has got to take off more as a runner. The lanes are wide open. This will literally put the fear of God in these defenses when he gashes them for 80+ yds/gm

Our receivers got absolutely no separation. All philly did was sit in cover 2

Philly played the zone as the Steelers they wanted Lamar to run so they can punish him, monken should have went away from his script and started calling slants, posts and crossing routes, this coaching staff is making the game harder than what it have to be

 

[mr heyzel]

Tomlin is licking his chops seeing these boys struggle with the zone again

 

[Blessings]

Salute to Shannon for staying consistent

Dan and others never use context when it comes to Lamar

 

[Blessings]

Why not