Skip and Shannon list their all time top 10

[VBM]

wrong thread

 

[VBM]

.

 

[Reign X]

Here are the playoffs stats for both teams:

2009 Los Angeles Lakers Player Stats - Playoffs

Stats per game recorded by the 2009 Lakers players in the Playoffs, including games, points, rebounds, assists, steals, blocks and shooting details.

www.landofbasketball.com

2003 San Antonio Spurs Player Stats - Playoffs

Stats per game recorded by the 2003 Spurs players in the Playoffs, including games, points, rebounds, assists, steals, blocks and shooting details.

www.landofbasketball.com

Kobe led the Lakers with 30ppg, Pau averaged 18ppg, Lamar put up 12ppg, and Ariza had 11ppg.

Duncan averaged 25ppg, Parker was at 15ppg, Stephen Jackson put up 13ppg, and Manu had 9 ppg.

The gap between Kobe and Duncan as #1 options was 5ppg. The gap between Pau and Tony was 3 ppg, the gap between Lamar and Stephen Jackson was 1ppg, the gap between Ariza and Manu was 2ppg.

The scoring stats at the very least say these rosters were very comparable. Kobe and Duncan had the biggest separation as #1 options in terms of PPG. Gasol and Tony were closer. And then as a 3rd option Stephen Jackson scored more than Lamar. While Ariza as the 4th option outscored Manu.

Tony ts% 47 , gasol ts% 62. Nowhere near the same, that’s a huge difference.

 

[Reign X]

You’re not making much sense using one game. The Spurs simply had a better team. People keep talking about that Spurs roster ignoring that it was a better roster than the 2003 Lakers. Outside of Kobe and Shaq that Lakers team didn’t have anything. All Duncan had to do was cancel our Shaq and it was a question of whether Kobe could outscore every Spurs role player combined. This was the same thing in 2004 once Malone went down. The Lakers got worse as much as the Spurs got better. I think 03 Duncan gets the nod because he didn’t have anyone as good as Shaq on his team. But Kobe was the best wing player in basketball and if you built a team around him then he could and would get you to the finals. That is why I used the 01 Sixers as an example. I think people forget that talent wasn’t as highly concentrated back then. Like Kobe and Shaq won 3 straight because no one else had two top 5 caliber players.

In the weak east, sure. Build a team around him equal to Duncan, does he get by him during 99-03 period? I think you’ve agreed with Duncan being ahead during that period which is mostly my point.

From 99-05, Duncan won more mvps then anyone, 3 championships, 3 finals mvps. Shaq was his only peer during any of that. Shaq peaked during 2000-2002.

 

[Swagnificent]

Tony ts% 47 , gasol ts% 62. Nowhere near the same, that’s a huge difference.

2009 Lakers TS% was 55.3%. 2009 NBA Playoffs Summary | Basketball-Reference.com

2003 Spurs TS% was 52.5%. 2009 NBA Playoffs Summary | Basketball-Reference.com

Kobe's 2009 TS% was 56.4%. Kobe 2009 Playoffs Ts% | StatMuse

Duncan’s 2003 TS% was 57.7%. Duncan 2003 Playoffs Ts% | StatMuse


So Tim had a 1.3% advantage over Kobe in shooting efficiency. Gasol had a 15% advantage over Parker. But yet the Spurs still ended up with a total team shooting efficiency only 3% less than the Lakers.


That confirms what I've maintained throughout this debate. Yes Gasol was a better second option than Parker. But the rest of the Spurs roster was better than the rest of the Lakers roster. Hence the closeness in overall shooting efficiency despite Gasol's huge advantage. Remember Manu was the 4th best player on that 2003 Spurs team compared to Trevor Ariza for the Lakers. Then you still had an effective David Robinson compared to an ailing Andrew Bynum.

The Spurs had better depth while the Lakers had the better top 2.

 

[Carlton Banks]

1. Jordan
2. Kareem
3. Magic
4. LeBron
5. Russell
6 Wilt
7. Kobe
8. Shaq
9. Bird
10. Duncan

 

[Carlton Banks]

Shaq is getting booted out eventually
People will start to look at his whole career and realize how he was washed/out of shape for a good portion of it

No way is he gonna be considered top 10 all time by the time bron or curry retire

Tim Duncan is another one who benefits from the system he plays in and was never super dominant like a Wilt or Kareem
He's gonna be removed too

4x champion (with a 3 peat)
3x finals MVP
1x MVP
3x All Star MVP
2x Scoring Champion

So far, he's still ahead of Curry, Bird, Oscar, Hakeem, and some others

 

[Ukbrotha]

Skip's list order is probably the worst I've ever seen.

 

[Shadow King]

Not reading all this

Half of it wasn't even for you

 

[Born2BKing]

1. Wilt
2. Russell
3. Kareem
4. Hakeem
5. Moses
6. D. Rob

nikka said David Robinson

 

[Deus]

Shaq is barely a Top 10 center, he can't be overall top 10

 

[Dark Knyght]

1. Jordan
2. Lebron
3. KAJ
4. Magic
5. Shaq
6. Bird
7. Kobe
8. Duncan
9. Wilt
10. Bill Russell