Jews against Zionism....The News you never see on TV

Koichos

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Biblically speaking, only the man determined tribal status. Its only with your people, who arent the same as the people in the book, that changed it :coffee:
Tribal status is still patrilineal.

Jeremiah 17:4
And thou, even thyself, shalt discontinue from thine heritage that I gave thee; and I will cause thee to serve thine enemies in the land which thou knowest not: for ye have kindled a fire in mine anger, which shall burn for ever.

Language is a part of heritage.. :coffee:
The heritage is dealing with the land. They will discontinue from their land, referring to their exile. Hence, it refers to the altars, groves, substance, treasures, high places and borders. Jeremiah 17:4 is not dealing with a disconnect from language nor is it dealing with a loss of ethnic identity.

Isaiah 59:21
"As for Me, this is My covenant with them," says the Lord. "My spirit, which is upon you and My words that I have placed in your mouth, shall not move from your mouth or from the mouth of your seed and from the mouth of your seed's seed," said the Lord, "from now and to eternity."

Sure, guy... Hebrews later on named themselves after a descendant of Japheth when they are supposed to be descendants of Shem.. What you eat dont make me shyt... But you are trying to feed me some BS... Im not buying it at all, and thankfully more and more people arent buying it.. It was fun though, if you continue to repeat yourself in remixed ways, I'll shoot you a friendly goodbye. Hopefully the readers can take whats been said here, and go from there...
Germany in Medieval Hebrew is called Ashkenaz. This term is thus applied to the Jews who settled along the Rhine in the Tenth Century CE.

Areas of Jewish settlement have historically been identified with biblical names:

Germany - Ashkenaz
Spain - Sepharad
France - Tsarfat
Bohemia - Kna'an
Yemen - Teman
 
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Everythingg

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Tribal status is still patrilineal.

So what have you been going on about? Thats what I said and you've been trying to pull verses that support your people going by the mother... Your people do the opposite of the what the people in the bible did...

The heritage is dealing with the land. They will discontinue from their land, referring to their exile. Hence, it refers to the altars, groves, substance, treasures, high places and borders. Jeremiah 17:4 is not dealing with a disconnect from language nor is it dealing with a loss of ethnic identity.

Isaiah 59:21
"As for Me, this is My covenant with them," says the Lord. "My spirit, which is upon you and My words that I have placed in your mouth, shall not move from your mouth or from the mouth of your seed and from the mouth of your seed's seed," said the Lord, "from now and to eternity."

You mean from the time when they repent like the verse right before it says right? Not "now" as in as when that was written? Jeremiah wrote about that same covenant in Jeremiah 31 which would come in the future. Not right then when that was written..

And heritage itself deals with everything from land, to culture, language, religion/spiritual beliefs etc... If a Russian moves to America and assimilates, eventually his descendants will lose their language. It doesnt mean they dont descend from a Russian...If Hebrews were to be scattered unto one end of the earth to another (Deuteronomy 28:64)and worship other gods, then of course they'd lose their language and culture eventually..

Germany in Medieval Hebrew is called Ashkenaz. This term is thus applied to the Jews who settled along the Rhine in the Tenth Century CE.

Areas of Jewish settlement have historically been identified with biblical names:

Germany - Ashkenaz
Spain - Sepharad
France - Tsarfat
Bohemia - Kna'an
Yemen - Teman

So first it was Hebrews calling another Hebrew a Moabite despite her not being a Moabite. Now its Hebrews calling the land they live in after an ancestor that isnt their own (Ashkenaz).. Based on what exactly? Their/your word lol. Again not buying it. I just like seeing how far I am in understanding this when I read stuff like this. But since we're basing land names off of Jewishness, how about Utah?
:sas1:

Moab Utah
Mount Nebo
Ephraim Utah

Just to name a few :sas2:
 

Koichos

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And heritage itself deals with everything from land, to culture, language, religion/spiritual beliefs etc
Parse the Hebrew so that you might better understand the scripture. The Hebrew word used for "heritage" in Jeremiah 17:4 is nachalah [נַחֲלָה], which means: "possession", "property", "inheritance", "heritage"; generally an estate, portion, or share; property that may be inherited. Hence, the passage is referring to a disconnect from the Land of Israel, and thus its fruits (groves, treasures, high places). G-d will "avenge [Himself]" of Israel; He will exile them from it for not keeping the law of the sabbatical year (Jer 17:21-24). Accordingly, the latter half of verse 4 reads: "And I will cause you to serve your enemies in the land that you do not know", a reference to their subsequent [Babylonian] exile. This is further supported by Jeremiah 17:2-3 which refers to a severance from altars, groves, substance, treasures, high places and borders. The surrounding verses demonstrate this disconnect to be dealing not with that of ethnic identity but with that of the land. In Parashat Ha'Azinu we are told that a righteous remnant of Israel shall always remain, lest the enemy distort and take credit [for His doing], for only He can blot the remembrance of His people from the earth.

The Hebrew word used for "discontinue" in Jeremiah 17:4 is shamat [שָׁמַט], which is the same word used in letting the land rest (Ex 23:11), and of releasing creditors (Deut 15:2) in the sabbatical year. If Israel failed to keep the Shmita, or the Sabbath rest for the land, the Lord would "impose the Shmita" and bring rest to that land. He would ensure that Israel was prevented from tilling the land and gathering the fruits of it- a practice that was enjoined on every seventh year when the land was to have its rest, or Sabbath (Ex 23:10), but this law they did not observe. When Israel was carried into the Babylonian captivity, G-d declared that they would remain in Babylon for 70 years (Jer 29:10): "For so said the LORD: For at the completion of seventy years of Babylon I will remember you, and I will fulfill My good word toward you, to restore you to this place". This was to be one year for each Shmita, or yearly Sabbath rest that they disregarded. Israel failed to observe the past 70 Shmitas, which meant that for 490 years prior to being carried off into captivity, they had farmed the land non-stop. These 70 years were fulfilled when Israel was released from Babylon and returned to Jerusalem in the first year of Cyrus of Persia (see II Chronicles 36:21-23, Ezra 1:1-4).

II Chronicles 36:21-23
21 to fulfil the word of the LORD by the mouth of Jeremiah, until the land had been paid her sabbaths; for as long as she lay desolate she kept sabbath, to fulfil threescore [sixty] and ten years.
22 And in the first year of Cyrus, king of Persia, at the completion of the word of the Lord in the mouth of Jeremiah, the Lord aroused the spirit of Cyrus the king of Persia, and he issued a proclamation throughout all his kingdom, and put it also in writing, saying:
23 "So said Cyrus the king of Persia: All the kingdoms of the earth has the Lord God of the heavens delivered to me, and He commanded me to build Him a House in Jerusalem, which is in Judea. Who among you is of all His people, may the Lord his God be with him, and he may ascend."

If Hebrews were to be scattered unto one end of the earth to another (Deuteronomy 28:64)and worship other gods, then of course they'd lose their language and culture eventually..
The Deuteronomy 28 curses failed to sever Jewish hashkafah, let alone the two-thousand year exile that followed. When the Jews gathered in Israel—the Polish Jew, the Russian Jew, the Persian Jew, the Kurdish Jew, the Bukharian Jew, the Moroccan Jew, the Turkish Jew, the Iraqi Jew, the Syrian Jew, the Yemeni Jew; Jews from all over the world—they all had the mezuzot in the same right side, the same Shema Yisrael inside, same tefillin, same tzitzit, same Sefer Torah; 99% of the customs the same. The migrations, persecutions, expulsions, pogroms; scattered few in number, every which way, and without any semblance of modern technology; still, Jews, defying the laws of history, kept one Torah, one mezuzah, one tefillin, one Shabbat, one circumcision, one matzah. Even the tefillin that were found at the Bar Kokhba revolt (132-136 CE) have the same parchment (klaf) that we use in tefillin to this day.

The scriptures express time and again that there would always be a righteous remnant of Israel, regardless of the exiles, the worshiping of other gods, the dwelling among the nations, and so forth; for G-d feared the wrath of the enemy, and the fact that the nations would have taken credit for blotting out G-d's people from the earth, which would bring dishonor to His holy name. We see this addressed in Deuteronomy 32:26-27, which states that G-d "WOULD" make their [Israel] remembrance decease from among men, "WERE IT NOT that the enemy's wrath was heaped up, lest their adversaries distort; LEST THEY CLAIM, 'Our hand was triumphant! The LORD did none of this!'" (Deut 32:27)

Now its Hebrews calling the land they live in after an ancestor that isnt their own (Ashkenaz).. Based on what exactly? Their/your word lol.
The Jerusalem Targum, Midrashim, Chazal, Geonim, Rashi, Maimonides, medieval rabbinical literature.

In Jewish medieval exegesis, Ashkenaz was identified with Germany, Tsarfat with France, and Sepharad with Spain (hence Sephardi for Mediterranean, and by extension non-Ashkenazi, Jews). The word "Gomer" in the Talmud is translated into Aramaic as Germamia [sic], similar phonetically to the Latin, Germania. In tractate Yoma it says, "Gomer, that is Germamia"; elsewhere we read: "Germamia.. i.e., Germany". A fifth-century identification of Ashkenaz with Germany appears in the Midrash of Bereshyt Rabbah, where it states, "Ashkenaz, Riphath, and Togarmah are
V02p193002.jpg
", which means German tribes or German lands. The Jerusalem Targum identifies Ashkenaz with the "Barbari", an ethnic connotation for the Germanic peoples who invaded the Roman Empire during the time of Chazal. The ninth-century work authored by Amulo of Lyons, entitled Contra Judaeos mentions how the Jews referred to the German Rhineland as Ashkenaz.

In Jewish tradition, Ashkenaz and his descendants were said to dwell in the "recesses" of the north, so the Germanic territory of northern Europe was termed Eretz Ashkenaz, or land of Ashkenaz. By the end of the first millennium Jews had moved into Ashkenaz (Germany) and established communities along the Rhine River. As the communities spread, so too would the designation of Ashkenazi, expanding by the end of the fourteenth century to include all Jews of northern Europe (north of Italy and Greece). Sepharad was believed to be to the west, so the region off to the western end of the Mediterranean (Spain and Portugal) was called Sepharad, and the Jews that would later inhabit, Sephardim. The Slavic region to which the Jews migrated, namely Bohemia and Moravia, was known as Eretz Kna'an, 'Land of Canaan'; so on and so forth.

Ashkenaz is the medieval Hebrew name for Germany. Ashkenazi Jew literally means "German Jew".
Sepharad is the medieval Hebrew name for Spain. Sephardi Jew literally means "Spanish Jew".
Teman is the medieval Hebrew name for Yemen. Temani Jew literally means "Yemeni Jew".


I just like seeing how far I am in understanding this when I read stuff like this. But since we're basing land names off of Jewishness, how about Utah?
:sas1:

Moab Utah
Mount Nebo
Ephraim Utah

Just to name a few :sas2:
(Jewish Virtual Library - Utah)
As early as 1826, Jewish trappers traversed the territory. In 1854, Jewish daguerreotypist and writer Solomon Nunes Carvalho traveling with Colonel John C. Fremont's mapmaking expedition yielded unparalleled images of the young Mormon community. That same year, Julius and Fannie Brooks became Utah's first Jewish family. Many Jewish entrepreneurs followed, establishing commercial shops and business ventures both large and small. Utah's early Jewish population was comprised of mostly middle-class and educated German émigrés (1857–1874) and pious Eastern European Jews (1890–1920).

(Utah History Encyclopedia - Jewish Community)
Jews came to Utah as a result of the 1849 gold rush in California, having found their California arrival too late for them to stake claims. These early Jewish settlers were of German and Hungarian descent, and they traveled in wagon trains from the east. The earlier Germanic Jewish population was largely replaced by Jewish immigration from eastern Europe after 1880. These Russian and Polish Jews were primarily Orthodox in contrast to the more liberal German Jews.

(Utah's Jewish History - The Earliest Utah Jews)
Jews in Utah in 2012 numbered about 5600, not much different from its population in 1899 of 5000, but Jews have been in Utah since the 1850s. The first wave of Jews came from Prussia and Germany; among the earliest comers being Isidor Morris, Nicholas S. Ransohoff, Samuel Kahn, Fred Auerbach, Louis Cohn, Aaron Greenewald, Ichel Watters, and Emanuel Kahn.
 

Everythingg

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Parse the Hebrew so that you might better understand the scripture. The Hebrew word used for "heritage" in Jeremiah 17:4 is nachalah [נַחֲלָה], which means: "possession", "property", "inheritance", "heritage"; generally an estate, portion, or share; property that may be inherited. Hence, the passage is referring to a disconnect from the Land of Israel, and thus its fruits (groves, treasures, high places). G-d will "avenge [Himself]" of Israel; He will exile them from it for not keeping the law of the sabbatical year (Jer 17:21-24). Accordingly, the latter half of verse 4 reads: "And I will cause you to serve your enemies in the land that you do not know", a reference to their subsequent [Babylonian] exile. This is further supported by Jeremiah 17:2-3 which refers to a severance from altars, groves, substance, treasures, high places and borders. The surrounding verses demonstrate this disconnect to be dealing not with that of ethnic identity but with that of the land. In Parashat Ha'Azinu we are told that a righteous remnant of Israel shall always remain, lest the enemy distort and take credit [for His doing], for only He can blot the remembrance of His people from the earth.

The Hebrew word used for "discontinue" in Jeremiah 17:4 is shamat [שָׁמַט], which is the same word used in letting the land rest (Ex 23:11), and of releasing creditors (Deut 15:2) in the sabbatical year. If Israel failed to keep the Shmita, or the Sabbath rest for the land, the Lord would "impose the Shmita" and bring rest to that land. He would ensure that Israel was prevented from tilling the land and gathering the fruits of it- a practice that was enjoined on every seventh year when the land was to have its rest, or Sabbath (Ex 23:10), but this law they did not observe. When Israel was carried into the Babylonian captivity, G-d declared that they would remain in Babylon for 70 years (Jer 29:10): "For so said the LORD: For at the completion of seventy years of Babylon I will remember you, and I will fulfill My good word toward you, to restore you to this place". This was to be one year for each Shmita, or yearly Sabbath rest that they disregarded. Israel failed to observe the past 70 Shmitas, which meant that for 490 years prior to being carried off into captivity, they had farmed the land non-stop. These 70 years were fulfilled when Israel was released from Babylon and returned to Jerusalem in the first year of Cyrus of Persia (see II Chronicles 36:21-23, Ezra 1:1-4).

II Chronicles 36:21-23
21 to fulfil the word of the LORD by the mouth of Jeremiah, until the land had been paid her sabbaths; for as long as she lay desolate she kept sabbath, to fulfil threescore [sixty] and ten years.
22 And in the first year of Cyrus, king of Persia, at the completion of the word of the Lord in the mouth of Jeremiah, the Lord aroused the spirit of Cyrus the king of Persia, and he issued a proclamation throughout all his kingdom, and put it also in writing, saying:
23 "So said Cyrus the king of Persia: All the kingdoms of the earth has the Lord God of the heavens delivered to me, and He commanded me to build Him a House in Jerusalem, which is in Judea. Who among you is of all His people, may the Lord his God be with him, and he may ascend."

:russell: Again, people being scattered to the ends of the earth will cause them to lose their land, culture, language etc..When you add in them worshiping the gods of the nations they were scatterd to, fathers and mothers being split from their children, wives and husbands being split all at the same time, it only adds to the probability. These are things Deuteronomy 28 says would happen right? Nothing you're saying changes that.

The Deuteronomy 28 curses failed to sever Jewish hashkafah, let alone the two-thousand year exile that followed. When the Jews gathered in Israel—the Polish Jew, the Russian Jew, the Persian Jew, the Kurdish Jew, the Bukharian Jew, the Moroccan Jew, the Turkish Jew, the Iraqi Jew, the Syrian Jew, the Yemeni Jew; Jews from all over the world—they all had the mezuzot in the same right side, the same Shema Yisrael inside, same tefillin, same tzitzit, same Sefer Torah; 99% of the customs the same. The migrations, persecutions, expulsions, pogroms; scattered few in number, every which way, and without any semblance of modern technology; still, Jews, defying the laws of history, kept one Torah, one mezuzah, one tefillin, one Shabbat, one circumcision, one matzah. Even the tefillin that were found at the Bar Kokhba revolt (132-136 CE) have te parchment (klaf) that we use in tefillin to this day.

The scriptures express time and again that there would always be a righteous remnant of Israel, regardless of the exiles, the worshiping of other gods, the dwelling among the nations, and so forth; for G-d feared the wrath of the enemy, and the fact that the nations would have taken credit for blotting out G-d's people from the earth, which would bring dishonor to His holy name. We see this addressed in Deuteronomy 32:26-27, which states that G-d "WOULD" make their [Israel] remembrance decease from among men, "WERE IT NOT that the enemy's wrath was heaped up, lest their adversaries distort; LEST THEY CLAIM, 'Our hand was triumphant! The LORD did none of this!'" (Deut 32:27)

But when did your people meet God face to face in the wilderness before entering the land that the bankers gave them? :jbhmm:

The Jerusalem Targum, Midrashim, Chazal, Geonim, Rashi, Maimonides, medieval rabbinical literature.

In Jewish medieval exegesis, Ashkenaz was identified with Germany, Tsarfat with France, and Sepharad with Spain (hence Sephardi for Mediterranean, and by extension non-Ashkitenazi, Jews). The word "Gomer" in the Talmud is translated into Aramaic as Germamia [sic], similar phonetically to the Latin, Germania. In tractate Yoma it says, "Gomer, that is Germamia"; elsewhere we read: "Germamia.. i.e., Germany". A fifth-century identification of Ashkenaz with Germany appears in the Midrash of Bereshyt Rabbah, where it states, "Ashkenaz, Riphath, and Togarmah are
V02p193002.jpg
", which means German tribes or German lands. The Jerusalem Targum identifies Ashkenaz with the "Barbari", an ethnic connotation for the Germanic peoples who invaded the Roman Empire during the time of Chazal. The ninth-century work authored by Amulo of Lyons, entitled Contra Judaeos mentions how the Jews referred to the German Rhineland as Ashkenaz.

In Jewish tradition, Ashkenaz and his descendants were said to dwell in the "recesses" of the north, so the Germanic territory of northern Europe was termed Eretz Ashkenaz, or land of Ashkenaz. By the end of the first millennium Jews had moved into Ashkenaz (Germany) and established communities along the Rhine River. As the communities spread, so too would the designation of Ashkenazi, expanding by the end of the fourteenth century to include all Jews of northern Europe (north of Italy and Greece). Sepharad was believed to be to the west, so the region off to the western end of the Mediterranean (Spain and Portugal) was called Sepharad, and the Jews that would later inhabit, Sephardim. The Slavic region to which the Jews migrated, namely Bohemia and Moravia, was known as Eretz Kna'an, 'Land of Canaan'; so on and so forth.

Ashkenaz is the medieval Hebrew name for Germany. Ashkenazi Jew literally means "German Jew".
Sepharad is the medieval Hebrew name for Spain. Sephardi Jew literally means "Spanish Jew".
Teman is the medieval Hebrew name for Yemen. Temani Jew literally means "Yemeni Jew".

So before it was Hebrews calling a Hebrew (Ruth) a Moabite, which was a banned tribe. Now its them naming themselves and their land after a descendant of Japheth. None of your explanations explains WHY they would do these things. They're just excuses you come up with to justify your people's claim to being Israelites. But no, an Israelite would not call an Israelite a Moabite nor would they refer to themselves or the land they're in as being of Japheth. Especially when Genesis 9:27 says the seed of Japheth will be in the tents (i.e. land) of Shem. All your points are confusion and I dont know if its because you're a confuser, or a person that has been passed down confusion. Either way, its false :coffee:

(Jewish Virtual Library - Utah)
As early as 1826, Jewish trappers traversed the territory. In 1854, Jewish daguerreotypist and writer Solomon Nunes Carvalho traveling with Colonel John C. Fremont's mapmaking expedition yielded unparalleled images of the young Mormon community. That same year, Julius and Fannie Brooks became Utah's first Jewish family. Many Jewish entrepreneurs followed, establishing commercial shops and business ventures both large and small. Utah's early Jewish population was comprised of mostly middle-class and educated German émigrés (1857–1874) and pious Eastern European Jews (1890–1920).

(Utah History Encyclopedia - Jewish Community)
Jews came to Utah as a result of the 1849 gold rush in California, having found their California arrival too late for them to stake claims. These early Jewish settlers were of German and Hungarian descent, and they traveled in wagon trains from the east. The earlier Germanic Jewish population was largely replaced by Jewish immigration from eastern Europe after 1880. These Russian and Polish Jews were primarily Orthodox in contrast to the more liberal German Jews.

(Utah's Jewish History - The Earliest Utah Jews)
Jews in Utah in 2012 numbered about 5600, not much different from its population in 1899 of 5000, but Jews have been in Utah since the 1850s. The first wave of Jews came from Prussia and Germany; among the earliest comers being Isidor Morris, Nicholas S. Ransohoff, Samuel Kahn, Fred Auerbach, Louis Cohn, Aaron Greenewald, Ichel Watters, and Emanuel Kahn.


Ok so you want smoke? :sas1:

Heres some questions for you...

How come Christopher Columbus said he was going to "conquer the Holy Land" before coming to America?
Why did he think he found the Garden of Eden in South America?
Why did he bring a Hebrew interpreter?
How come Arron de Montezinos said he met people in Peru reciting the Shema?
How come American topographers drew a map of an Indian mound in Ohio having the menorah?
 

Koichos

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But when did your people meet God face to face in the wilderness before entering the land that the bankers gave them? :jbhmm:
2,600 years ago during the transition period between G-d's reclaim of the exiles and their restoration to Jerusalem.

How come Christopher Columbus said he was going to "conquer the Holy Land" before coming to America?
Columbus sought to use the riches of the "Indies" to finance a Spanish military campaign to reconquer the Holy Land (Jerusalem).


On the 26th of December, 1492 while in the Caribbean, Columbus notes in his diary that he wanted to find enough gold and the almost equally valuable spices "in such quantity that the sovereigns. . . will undertake and prepare to go conquer the Holy Sepulchre; for thus I urged Your Highnesses to spend all the profits of this my enterprise on the conquest of Jerusalem" (The Diario of Christopher Columbus’s First Voyage to America 1492 – 1493 [Dunn and Kelley, 1989], p. 291).

In a letter dated 4 March 1493, purportedly written at sea to King Ferdinand and Queen Isabela just before he arrived back from the first voyage, Columbus claimed "that in seven years from today I will be able to pay Your Highnesses for five thousand cavalry and fifty thousand foot soldiers for the war and conquest of Jerusalem, for which purpose this enterprise was undertaken" (Margarita Zamora, Reading Columbus, [Zamora, 1993], p. 19).

In still another letter, referred to as Lettera Rarissima, written on 7 July 1503 in Hispaniola and addressed to the Sovereigns, Columbus describes the events of the fourth voyage. Toward the end of the letter the theme of the re-conquest of Jerusalem recurs: "Jerusalem and Mount Sion are to be rebuilt by the hands of Christians, who it is to be G-d told by the mouth of His prophet in the fourteenth Psalm. The Abbot Joaquim said that he who should do this was to come from Spain" (Letter of Columbus on the Fourth Voyage, pp. 413-414).

Why did he think he found the Garden of Eden in South America?
In his letter to the Spanish monarch (August, 1498), Columbus notes the incredible amount of water that was flowing into the sea; and in those days it was believed that all great rivers flowed from Eden, which lay in the far-eastern portion of Asia. Columbus thought he had found the way back home again to where it all began; or, at the very least, as he puts it, "if the water of which I speak does not proceed from the earthly Paradise, it seems to be a still greater wonder". Of course, he thought he was on the east coast of Asia. In reality, Columbus had stumbled upon the mouth of the Orinoco River.

August, 1498: "I have never either read or heard of so great a quantity of fresh water so coming into and near the salt...and the very mild climate also supports this view; and if the water of which I speak does not proceed from the earthly Paradise, it seems to be a still greater wonder, for I do not believe that there is known in the world a river so great and so deep" (Jean Delumeau, History of Paradise: The Garden of Eden in Myth and Tradition, [Continuum, 1994], p. 54).

Why did he bring a Hebrew interpreter?
For communication with local Jewish traders in Asia (the presumed destination).

How come Arron de Montezinos said he met people in Peru reciting the Shema?
Sephardic Jews have been in South America since the late fifteenth century; and in Peru, since the early-middle sixteenth century following its capture by the Spanish in 1533-34. Montezinos claims to have met Natives who recited the Shema in the middle seventeenth century, more than one hundred years after the earliest settlement of Jews (and so Sephardic influence cannot be ruled out); but even more interesting is that they have a god called Adom Olen, perhaps derived from Adon Olam ("Lord of the World"), a hymn composed by the Sephardic Jewish poet, Solomon Ibn Gabirol, in the eleventh century. However, it was not until the fifteenth century that Adon Olam became a standard part of the Jewish liturgy, indeed further supporting a consequence of Sephardic Jewish influence. Thus, assuming Montezinos' claims to be true, the most plausible answer is that these Natives learned the Shema, as well as the name they use for their god, Adom Olen, through a close relationship with early Sephardic Jewish settlers.

How come American topographers drew a map of an Indian mound in Ohio having the menorah?
"More and more evidence based on increasingly sophisticated and less passionate ethnography pointed to the simple reality—the Indians were not Israelites. This was, as Popkin stated, one of the most important reasons that the Jewish Indian theory eventually died. There was simply no plausible evidence for the claim. The only real evidence found in America was a strange earthwork (a mound) discovered in Philadelphia in 1722, which, for a while, was taken to be the work of the ten lost tribes. The debate gradually dissipated as increasingly sophisticated archaeological and ethnographic research tied it to known Native American practices"
(Zvi Ben-Dor Benite, The Ten Lost Tribes, [Oxford University Press, 2009], p. 182).
 
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Everythingg

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2,600 years ago during the transition period between G-d's reclaim of the exiles and their restoration to Jerusalem.

Its mighty convenient that everything that supposedly ties your people to the scripture happened thousands of years ago :sas1:

We dont have to go back thousands and thousands of years to find a time black people went on ships to a land of bondage. We have that with the slave story. And with that comes black people in iron yokes, families being split up, foreigners being placed above them in their own communities. You know, things Deuteronomy 28 says...

But anyways, if you can, show me this exact event, then show King David ruling over the people underneath God, then explain why this was short lived and not FOREVER. Because the book of Ezekiel says these things about the "restoration"....

Columbus sought to use the riches of the "Indies" to finance a Spanish military campaign to reconquer the Holy Land (Jerusalem).

Read your quote. He prepared to go conquer the "Holy Sepulchre" and urged King Ferdinand and Queen Isabella to fund his conquest. Why would he ask them to fund his trip, so he could garner more money, so that he could eventually go conquer another piece of land? And why would he go to a land full of resources to go conquer that dry patch of land that the bankers gave your people? And while we're on the topic of bankers, whats this about?

907d33cf491f44bafef5ce1114cc34b6.jpg

Where is freemasonry mentioned in the Torah?

In his letter to the Spanish monarch (August, 1498), Columbus notes the incredible amount of water that was flowing into the sea; and in those days it was believed that all great rivers flowed from Eden, which lay in the far-eastern portion of Asia. Columbus thought he had found the way back home again to where it all began; or, at the very least, as he puts it, "if the water of which I speak does not proceed from the earthly Paradise, it seems to be a still greater wonder". Of course, he thought he was on the east coast of Asia. In reality, Columbus had stumbled upon the mouth of the Orinoco River.

August, 1498: "I have never either read or heard of so great a quantity of fresh water so coming into and near the salt...and the very mild climate also supports this view; and if the water of which I speak does not proceed from the earthly Paradise, it seems to be a still greater wonder, for I do not believe that there is known in the world a river so great and so deep" (Jean Delumeau, History of Paradise: The Garden of Eden in Myth and Tradition, [Continuum, 1994], p. 54).
Well no. The belief that he planned to go to Asia and had thought he found Asia is a myth.. And if you want to use the "Indian" tidbit, understand that "indios" in his language doesnt mean a land of India. It means "of God". Which is what he was looking for. The (people)of God. :coffee:

The same year he touched down in the Americas, is the same year Jews were expelled from Spain. How "convenient"....
For communication with local Jewish traders in Asia (the presumed destination).

Prove it :coffee:

Sephardic Jews have been in South America since the late fifteenth century; and in Peru, since the early-middle sixteenth century following its capture by the Spanish in 1533-34. Montezinos claims to have met Natives who recited the Shema in the middle seventeenth century, more than one hundred years after the earliest settlement of Jews (and so Sephardic influence cannot be ruled out); but even more interesting is that they have a god called Adom Olen, perhaps derived from Adon Olam ("Lord of the World"), a hymn composed by the Sephardic Jewish poet, Solomon Ibn Gabirol, in the eleventh century. However, it was not until the fifteenth century that Adon Olam became a standard part of the Jewish liturgy, indeed further supporting a consequence of Sephardic Jewish influence. Thus, assuming Montezinos' claims to be true, the most plausible answer is that these Natives learned the Shema, as well as the name they use for their god, Adom Olen, through a close relationship with early Sephardic Jewish settlers.

Nope. Heres what the people of Peru looked like. Pay attention to the last man in the middle row and how white people follow after him:

per-100118-9305-lima-museo-larco-inca-kings-tree-zoom-after-athaualpa-king-carlos-v-of-spain.jpg

That man would King Charles the 5th of the Roman Empire. Oh and no this from that same area:

inca.jpg

So we dont look at what you or your people say anymore in regards to this. We read the scriptures and see what your people said in the past before the okie doke was put in place and go with that.

"More and more evidence based on increasingly sophisticated and less passionate ethnography pointed to the simple reality—the Indians were not Israelites. This was, as Popkin stated, one of the most important reasons that the Jewish Indian theory eventually died. There was simply no plausible evidence for the claim. The only real evidence found in America was a strange earthwork (a mound) discovered in Philadelphia in 1722, which, for a while, was taken to be the work of the ten lost tribes. The debate gradually dissipated as increasingly sophisticated archaeological and ethnographic research tied it to known Native American practices"
(Zvi Ben-Dor Benite, The Ten Lost Tribes, [Oxford University Press, 2009], p. 182).

Quote courtesy of "Zvi Ben-Dor Benite" :mjlol:

I.e. your blood is playing dumb like you are. Why would "Native Americans" who are not Israelites, build mounds with Israelite symbols? Heres the map of an area in Ohio from the 1700s by the US government sponsored (meaning the US paid him to survey lands and draw maps)man Isaac Roberdeau:

efw.gif

And mind you, "someone(s)" went and destroyed the mounds after this map was made. Also keep in mind that you can believe whatever you like. I’m not trying to convince you. I’m doing this for those reading so they can hopefully do their own research
 

Koichos

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Its mighty convenient that everything that supposedly ties your people to the scripture happened thousands of years ago :sas1:

We dont have to go back thousands and thousands of years to find a time black people went on ships to a land of bondage. We have that with the slave story. And with that comes black people in iron yokes, families being split up, foreigners being placed above them in their own communities. You know, things Deuteronomy 28 says...
The iron yoke mentioned in Deuteronomy 28:48 pertains to the fate of the Jews during the period of the Neo-Babylonian Empire (626-539 BCE).
We see this fulfilled in Jeremiah 28, verses 13 and 14, which describes this event taking place under Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon.
What's more, the concept of the iron yoke is found in only two places in the entire Tanach: Deuteronomy 28, and Jeremiah 28.

But anyways, if you can, show me this exact event, then show King David ruling over the people underneath God, then explain why this was short lived and not FOREVER. Because the book of Ezekiel says these things about the "restoration"....
There are many prophecies in the Book of Ezekiel; some have passed and some are coming to pass. In Ezekiel 37, the term 'king' is applied to the future ruler. Elsewhere (Ezek. 34:24) we see the word 'prince' (cf. Ezek. 37:24, 'king'), and it is used in the same context: `And I the LORD will be their God, and My servant David [will be] prince among them; I the LORD have spoken'. 'King' and 'prince' are used indifferently in the Book of Ezekiel regarding the arrival of the Moshiach.

Even the very next verse (Ezek. 37:25) uses the word 'prince', in the same way Ezekiel 37:24 uses 'king': `And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob My servant, wherein your fathers dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, they, and their children, and their children's children, for ever; and David My servant shall be their prince for ever.' The unfolding events leading up to Moshiach will help to facilitate the full restoration of 'the house of Israel', i.e., the ten lost tribes.

Ezekiel 37 is dealing with the Messianic Age and the arrival of Moshiach—a descendant of the house of David; not David himself. David was a messiah (anointed) for his time; so, too, King Saul, whom David succeeded. Even Cyrus of Persia, a non-Jew, is referred to as a messiah: לִמְשִׁיחוֹ (Isa. 45:1). 'The Moshiach', however, is a scion of the house of David via Solomon. More specifically, the Moshiach is from the tribe of Judah, of the house of David, and a descendant of King Solomon.

On one hand, Chazal talk about Nisan as the month of redemption; on the other hand, one of the thirteen principles of faith, from Maimonides' Thirteen Principles of Faith, is that one is to wait for Moshiach every single day. But the short answer is: Moshiach can come every day of the year, except of course on Shabbos and Yom Tov- even Erev Shabbos he won't come. Nonetheless, there are certain times that are more auspicious than others, and the month of Nisan is certainly that.

"Elijah the prophet said to Rav Yehuda, brother of Rav Sala Ḥasida: The world will exist no fewer than eighty-five Jubilee cycles, or 4,250 years. And during the final Jubilee, the son of David will come. Rav Yehuda said to Elijah: Will the Messiah come during the beginning of the Jubilee or during its end? Elijah said to Rav Yehuda: I do not know. Rav Yehuda asked: Will this last Jubilee cycle end before the Messiah comes? Elijah said to him: I do not know" (b. Sanh. 97b).

Quote courtesy of "Zvi Ben-Dor Benite" :mjlol:

I.e. your blood is playing dumb like you are. Why would "Native Americans" who are not Israelites, build mounds with Israelite symbols? Heres the map of an area in Ohio from the 1700s by the US government sponsored (meaning the US paid him to survey lands and draw maps)man Isaac Roberdeau:

efw.gif
Apophenia.

The Hanukiah, i.e., the eight-branched (nine-lamp) menorah used for Chanukah, was not developed until (after) 164 BCE following the Maccabean Revolt—the recapture of Jerusalem and the Temple from the Greek-Syrian Seleucid army. The ten northern tribes vanished five centuries prior, and, therefore, were not only unaware of this event (which Chanukah commemorates), but also of the nine-lamp candelabrum, which is itself a common-era innovation. The Chanukah menorah is entirely extra-biblical; the original [menorah] is the sacred, six-branched Biblical menorah that G-d revealed to Moses (Ex. 25:31-40)—the same six-branch design that later stood in the Holy Temple until its destruction. The story of Chanukah is not found in the Torah (or the Tanach); our Sages enacted the eight-day festival, which commemorates the rededication of the Second Temple by the Hasmonean dynasty in the Second Century BCEcenturies too late to have anything to do with the Ten Lost Tribes (722 BCE), conclusively ruling them out of any such authorship.

"The Gemara asks: What is [the reason of] Hanukkah, and why are lights kindled on Hanukkah? The Gemara answers: For our Sages taught: On the twenty-fifth of Kislev [commence] the days of Hanukkah, which are eight on which a lamentation for the dead and fasting are forbidden. For when the Greeks entered the Temple, they defiled all the oils therein, and when the Hasmonean dynasty prevailed against and defeated them, they made search and found only one cruse of oil which lay with the seal of the High Priest, but which contained sufficient for one day's lighting only; yet a miracle was wrought therein and they lit [the lamp] therewith for eight days. The following year these [days] were appointed a Festival with [the recital of] Hallel and thanksgiving" (b. Shabbat 21b).
 

Everythingg

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The iron yoke mentioned in Deuteronomy 28:48 pertains to the fate of the Jews during the period of the Neo-Babylonian Empire (626-539 BCE).
We see this fulfilled in Jeremiah 28, verses 13 and 14, which describes this event taking place under Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon.
What's more, the concept of the iron yoke is found in only two places in the entire Tanach: Deuteronomy 28, and Jeremiah 28.

You're grasping for straws. Jeremiah 28 was to Hanniah, a false prophet. It has nothing to do with the curses for disobeying the law as Deuteronomy 28 does. Not to mention that, again, everything you say applies to your people happened thousands and thousands of years ago. While the things that I say happened to my people happened hundreds of years ago, some of which have photographic evidence

4422631.jpg


There are many prophecies in the Book of Ezekiel; some have passed and some are coming to pass.


Not going past this. Again, the prophecy says that BEFORE the Israelites enter the land they will meet God face to face in the wilderness where He will purge out the rebels from their midst before they enter into the land. This didnt happen to your people. Not to mention, again, that bankers gave your people that land. Bankers who are admittedly, freemasons...

Link%20Between%20The%20Egyptian%20Mystery%20Religion%20And%20The%20Masonic%20Lodge.jpg

They put that stamp there not me. So for a second time, what does freemasonry have to do with the Torah?


The Hanukiah, i.e., the eight-branched (nine-lamp) menorah used for Chanukah, was not developed until (after) 164 BCE following the Maccabean Revolt.

I didnt ask for an explanation. I asked you why they were creating mounds with Hebrew symbols? You shoulda just let this die as even with you going and trying to get help, this is not something you'll come out on top.
 

Koichos

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Jeremiah 28 was to Hanniah, a false prophet. It has nothing to do with the curses for disobeying the law as Deuteronomy 28 does.
The curse was fulfilled by the Word of G-d Himself. Jeremiah 28 provides the fruition of the iron yoke as prophesied by Deuteronomy 28.

Not to mention that, again, everything you say applies to your people happened thousands and thousands of years ago. While the things that I say happened to my people happened hundreds of years ago, some of which have photographic evidence

4422631.jpg
Deuteronomy 28 is one of the many ancient prophecies. It covers the time of the Assyrian Exile to the destruction of the Second Temple to the Bar Kokhba revolt.

Not going past this. Again, the prophecy says that BEFORE the Israelites enter the land they will meet God face to face in the wilderness where He will purge out the rebels from their midst before they enter into the land. This didnt happen to your people.
Ezekiel 20 (and the 'wilderness of the peoples') was fulfilled after G-d's reclaim of the exiles, during the passage through the wilderness from Babylon to Jerusalem (538
BCE); though because of those who transgressed, and who, as a result, were liable for kerat (to be 'cut-off'), ultimately fewer exiles were returned [to Jerusalem] than were initially recovered [from captivity].

Rashi notes that Ezekiel called this transition period, between redeem from captivity and restoration to Jerusalem, the 'wilderness of the peoples' because many nations bordered upon it. When gathered (Ezek. 20:34), the exiles, now redeemed, were brought into the wilderness of the peoples (into the desert, bordered by many nations), adjoining those among whom they were dispersed (Ezek. 20:25). Ezekiel 20:36 then draws a parallel—this was to be to them what the wilderness of Sinai had been in the time of the Exodus: `As I contended with your forefathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so will I contend with you.'
 

Everythingg

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The curse was fulfilled by the Word of G-d Himself. Jeremiah 28 provides the fruition of the iron yoke as prophesied by Deuteronomy 28.




Deuteronomy 28 is one of the many ancient prophecies. It covers the time of the Assyrian Exile to the destruction of the Second Temple to the Bar Kokhba revolt.

Even if we go with that, you cant prove that those people it happened to, are your people. :coffee:

On the other hand:

aboriginals_1906.jpg

Of course these being negro looking people in Australia. So now that makes Australia and America. I wonder why in modern times only negro looking people are being put in yokes like Deuteronomy 28 says would happen to Israelites if they disobeyed the commandments?
:jbhmm:

I ask you and you say "Oh it happened thousands and thousands of years ago". You ask me and I can show you pictures.. Wonder how that works out?
:patrice:

Ezekiel 20 (and the 'wilderness of the peoples') was fulfilled after G-d's reclaim of the exiles,'

Q6LJ.gif


I'll ask again. Why is there are freemason relic where the supreme court of a supposed Torah believing country? Add onto that, why do yall have gay parades there?
 

Koichos

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Even if we go with that, you cant prove that those people it happened to, are your people. :coffee:

On the other hand:

aboriginals_1906.jpg

Of course these being negro looking people in Australia. So now that makes Australia and America. I wonder why in modern times only negro looking people are being put in yokes like Deuteronomy 28 says would happen to Israelites if they disobeyed the commandments?
:jbhmm:
Hananiah transgressed the third commandment (Ex 20:7)—he prophesied [falsely] in His name, twice; [first] inside the Holy Temple before the priests and all the people (Jer 28:2-4), as it is written: "in the house of the Lord" (Jer 28:1). Hananiah then does so [uses His name in vain] while breaking the bars from around the neck of Jeremiah (Jer 28:10-11). In spite of G-d's forewarning of false prophets prophesying in His name (Jer 27:9-10), and of taking heed to their words—"For I have not sent them...they are prophesying in My name falsely...heed them not" (Jer 27:14-16)—we see in Jeremiah 28:6 that Jeremiah does just that [heeds the words of Hananiah]: "Amen! So may the Lord do." The nation is thus brought-under the iron yoke (Jer 28:13-14), and Hananiah is sentenced to death (Jer 28:15-17).

I ask you and you say "Oh it happened thousands and thousands of years ago". You ask me and I can show you pictures.. Wonder how that works out?
:patrice:
The prophesied iron yoke is seen fulfilled within the actual pages of the Tanach.
 

Everythingg

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Hananiah transgressed

Q6LJ.gif


I didnt ask for an explanation of what Hanniah did. I asked you why black people are the ONLY people in modern times having yokes put on their necks?



The prophesied iron yoke is seen fulfilled within the actual pages of the Tanach.

I'll ask again. Why is there a freemason relic on the grounds of your supreme court? Why do yall have gay parades in what is supposed to be a Torah obedient country? If you want to duck the questions, stop going back and asking Rabbi for answers and dip out the thread for good... :coffee:
 

Koichos

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Why do yall have gay parades in what is supposed to be a Torah obedient country?
Disobedience; hence G-d's accusation of our being "stiff necked".

"A stiff-necked people"; G-d reiterates this phrase throughout the Tanach regarding the stubbornness [i.e., the transgression] of the Jewish nation.

We stood at Mount Sinai and G-d said, "You shall not make for yourself a graven image" (Ex 20:4). Forty days later we said: ehhh... (Ex 32:8-9).
 

Everythingg

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Disobedience; hence G-d's accusation of our being "stiff necked".

Disobedience? But to even get the land you had to be in OBEDIENCE:

Deuteronomy 30
When all these blessings and curses I have set before you come on you and you take them to heart wherever the Lord your God disperses you among the nations, 2 and when you and your children return to the Lord your God and obey him with all your heart and with all your soul according to everything I command you today, 3 then the Lord your God will restore your fortunesa]">[a] and have compassion on you and gather you again from all the nations where he scattered you.

Once the Israelites obey THEN they'd have their fortunes restored. Yet we dont see that with your people. In fact, is there ANY prophecy your people fit in modern times?


Q6LJ.gif


Nice try. I'll ask again, why are negroid looking people the ONLY ONES in modern times being put in yokes like the bible says would happen to the Israelites?
:jbhmm:
 
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