I wonder how those Boko Haram *** niqqas in Nigeria feel about Saudia Arabia...

[theworldismine13]

The only mistake these women made is believing in a filthy arab religion

 

[Mr. Somebody]

The only mistake these women made is believing in a filthy arab religion

You neg repped me for speaking on the truth? Sickening on your part. The truth is the truth. We shouldnt allow people to paint lies just to paint demonic pictures. Let the message shine from whats reality instead of allowing a bias to make us believe any statement that is made. Im dissapointed in you, friend. As someone whos part of the freedom alliance i thought you'd take less of a thought police approach to this topic. But i guess your emotions regarding muslims are getting a bit out of control maybe. Its so demonic, friend.

 

[RadaMillz]

How are u gonna perform pilgrimage to hajj without a mahram? This has been a clear issue since the first Hajj, why do these women all of a sudden think they are exempt from the law?

 

[emoney]

even if they were sent home for being Black, Nigerian Muslims would still attempt to rationalize the racism if its coming from an Islamic source....believe me

 

[zerozero]

You can't make up your own rules when you go to Mecca, it aint a vacation and it aint that kind of party. Stick to talking football breh.

basically I'm sorry for what these women are going through,
but if you aren't going with your father, brother, son, other type of appropriate relation you shouldn't be doing hajj.
It's not about islamic rules intruding on civic life here, the Hajj is inherently an islamic activity

 

[theworldismine13]

You neg repped me for speaking on the truth? Sickening on your part. The truth is the truth. We shouldnt allow people to paint lies just to paint demonic pictures. Let the message shine from whats reality instead of allowing a bias to make us believe any statement that is made. Im dissapointed in you, friend. As someone whos part of the freedom alliance i thought you'd take less of a thought police approach to this topic. But i guess your emotions regarding muslims are getting a bit out of control maybe. Its so demonic, friend.

yeah but the facts are also that these filthy degenerates were mistreating black women, and the black woman is a goddess and must always be treated as such

BBC News - Nigeria Hajj row over unescorted women

im simply disappointed with you that you, a black man, would prioritize a defense of a heathen religion over a defense of a goddess, perhaps you have been possessed by the demon named White Jesus

 

[Mr. Somebody]

yeah but the facts are also that these filthy degenerates were mistreating black women, and the black woman is a goddess and must always be treated as such

BBC News - Nigeria Hajj row over unescorted women

im simply disappointed with you that you, a black man, would prioritize a defense of a heathen religion over a defense of a goddess, perhaps you have been possessed by the demon named White Jesus

Women were put on earth to serve and obey men not to be worshipped as dieties, friend. That said, in this situation it looks like both the Saudi Arabian and Nigerian governments are treating these women demonically. Saudis are obviously going extra hard on them for their transgression but Nigeria, their homeland is closing the door for their return to their country to obtain their male escorts. Why would they do this? There is a bigger issue going on here then the Hajj. I guess when the Nigerian officials reach Saudi Arabia more details will emerge.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

basically I'm sorry for what these women are going through,
but if you aren't going with your father, brother, son, other type of appropriate relation you shouldn't be doing hajj.
It's not about islamic rules intruding on civic life here, the Hajj is inherently an islamic activity

Didn't you call yourself a feminist?

If so, then why not encourage Islam to open up the Hajj to women without a male escort, similar to how there was a movement to allow females in the Catholic clergy instead of supporting patriarchy just because its under the umbrella of religion?

 

[The Real]

It's not about islamic rules intruding on civic life here, the Hajj is inherently an islamic activity

And is Islam an inherently patriarchal religion with patronizing views towards women? I'm sure there are a considerable number of self-professed Muslims who would disagree.

 

[zerozero]

This is the rule for Hajj that the Saudis have. I didn't make it yo. Certainly a bunch of women just showing up in Makkah without their required companion isn't going to suddenly bypass that rule.

If changing this rule has support inside the religious community then more power to them. We'll have to see.

 

[The Real]

This is the rule for Hajj that the Saudis have. I didn't make it yo. Certainly a bunch of women just showing up in Makkah without their required companion isn't going to suddenly bypass that rule.

If changing this rule has support inside the religious community then more power to them. We'll have to see.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that you made the rule, literally or by association or metaphor, or that the women here are taking a stand or have a chance of changing the rules. It's just difficult to understand from some perspectives, mine included, why your response would be relatively conservative ("This is the rule for Hajj," "if you aren't going with your father, brother, son, other type of appropriate relation you shouldn't be doing hajj," "we'll have to see," etc) and thus coterminous with the response of an actual, orthodox/conservative Muslim like onedeen, whose justification is much more understandable. I think the situation is less cut-and-dry than your response makes it seem.

 

[zerozero]

I don't think anyone is suggesting that you made the rule, literally or by association or metaphor, or that the women here are taking a stand or have a chance of changing the rules. It's just difficult to understand from some perspectives, mine included, why your response would be relatively conservative ("This is the rule for Hajj," "if you aren't going with your father, brother, son, other type of appropriate relation you shouldn't be doing hajj," "we'll have to see," etc) and thus coterminous with the response of an actual, orthodox/conservative Muslim like onedeen, whose justification is much more understandable.

The Haj is an islamic activity and makkah is an islamic city. Just cause I'm feminist influenced doesn't mean I'd like to go through social / political systems with a meat grinder hoping to turn every place into LA. It depends on the stakeholders involved, if there's some huge split between muslim men and womens' opinions on this then I'd support the women's POV probably.

 

[The Real]

The Haj is an islamic activity and makkah is an islamic city. Just cause I'm feminist influenced doesn't mean I'd like to go through social / political systems with a meat grinder hoping to turn every place into LA. It depends on the stakeholders involved, if there's some huge split between muslim men and womens' opinions on this then I'd support the women's POV probably.

Of course, but no one here is endorsing that, either. I'm not planning to go to Saudi Arabia and start preaching about women's rights. That doesn't mean I don't think their patriarchal laws are repulsive, though, or that I'd take up a viewpoint that is coterminous with that of the authorities there, regardless of what the ideological split there looks like. Those don't seem like the only two options to me.

 

[zerozero]

Of course, but no one here is endorsing that, either. I'm not planning to go to Saudi Arabia and start preaching about women's rights. That doesn't mean I don't think their patriarchal laws are repulsive, though, or that I'd take up a viewpoint that is coterminous with that of the authorities there, regardless of what the ideological split there looks like. Those don't seem like the only two options to me.

well my viewpoint was assuming that there was a basic theological rule here (ie there was no requirement to undertake this voyage if you couldn't arrange for an appropriate companion) but quick googling suggests that's not the case and it's one of the saudis' particular implementations. You guys further asked whether I wouldn't support a less strict interpretation if that were the case and sure, I would. But in the end , regardless of whether a change would occur by a different interpretation or by challenging the saudi implementation, I don't just sit outside systems, come to a platonic interpretation of tweaks I'd make to it and then churn out results. I mean, hell, from a nonreligious perspective one would just tell everyone they're circumambulating a place with no particular relevance to god and shouldn't bother (lol) So you have to work with the principles of a system with its internal actors if you're interested in its legitimate development

 

[88m3]

well my viewpoint was assuming that there was a basic theological rule here (ie there was no requirement to undertake this voyage if you couldn't arrange for an appropriate companion) but quick googling suggests that's not the case and it's one of the saudis' particular implementations. You guys further asked whether I wouldn't support a less strict interpretation if that were the case and sure, I would. But in the end , regardless of whether a change would occur by a different interpretation or by challenging the saudi implementation, I don't just sit outside systems, come to a platonic interpretation of tweaks I'd make to it and then churn out results. I mean, hell, from a nonreligious perspective one would just tell everyone they're circumambulating a place with no particular relevance to god and shouldn't bother (lol) So you have to work with the principles of a system with its internal actors if you're interested in its legitimate development

Whens the last time you hit your wife?