How much further can TV take the anti-hero towards evil?

[HHR]

It's been interesting over the last 10+ years to watch television involve into the powerful storytelling medium it has become. It's always had the ability to develop strong connections between the audience and the characters, but recently that connection has forced audiences to care for bad guys.

I'm not POSITIVE, but I think this trend started with The Sopranos. Tony is a mob boss responsible for a tremendous amount of death and nearly as evil things...but the show asks the audience to care about him in spite of that. Maybe it's because it was, for the most part, only hurting others "in the game"...

Similarly, The Shield took a phenomenally bad 'bad cop' in Vic Mackey and let us root for him to escape justice from week to week. Again, the fact that he was still achieving some for the side of good and at least some of his motivation was to support his sick children probably allowed audiences to give him the benefit of the doubt...

I feel like this type of character has peaked with Walter White in Breaking Bad. In the show's beginning, he was a mildly sympathetic character who was only selling drugs to save up enough cash to support his family in the event he succumbed to cancer. Midway through the 5th season though, he has lost all traits of an anti-hero is essentially just a full blown villain. There is nothing inherently good left in any of his actions.

Is there anywhere left for this kind of character to go? Can a show succeed if the main character BEGINS as evil as Walter White has become?

/rant

 

[TMillzy]

Breaking Bad was meant to be that way. It was wrote for the protagonist to turn into the antagonist.

 

[Mr. Negative]

I remember watching Profit back in the day... dude was flat out evil. The main reason the show flopped then is solely because people couldn't deal with his amorality.

If it came out now, it would be a HUGE hit.

Profit is an American television series that originally aired on the Fox Broadcasting Company in 1996. The series was created by David Greenwalt and John McNamara, and stars Adrian Pasdar as the titular character, Jim Profit. In February 2008, episodes began airing on Chiller in the USA. In October 2010, episodes began airing on CBS Action in Europe.

Considered by many to be ahead of its time, the show is a precursor to more recent edgy television shows that include The Sopranos, Nip/Tuck, Dexter, Breaking Bad, and The Shield. Subversive themes stemming from the amoral actions of the central character made the show uncomfortable and unfamiliar viewing for mainstream audiences and Fox network affiliates, which ultimately led to the demise of the series.

Jim Profit is a newly-promoted employee following the heart attack death of the former VP of Acquisitions at Gracen & Gracen (G&G), a multinational corporation that is less than ethical with some of its business practices. That does not worry Profit, who is not above blackmail, bribery, extortion, or even murder to get ahead in the company. Jim Profit would routinely break the fourth wall and speak directly to the audience with such quotes as: "The line most people say they won't cross - it's usually something they've already done when they thought no one was watching."

 

[HHR]

Interesting...although I may have stopped watching after finding out his name is Profit. That's just fukking dumb lol.

 

[winb83]

An anti-hero taken too far is basically a story told from the perspective of the protagonist being a villain.

 

[Majestic Pape]

It's been interesting over the last 10+ years to watch television involve into the powerful storytelling medium it has become. It's always had the ability to develop strong connections between the audience and the characters, but recently that connection has forced audiences to care for bad guys.

I'm not POSITIVE, but I think this trend started with The Sopranos. Tony is a mob boss responsible for a tremendous amount of death and nearly as evil things...but the show asks the audience to care about him in spite of that. Maybe it's because it was, for the most part, only hurting others "in the game"...

Similarly, The Shield took a phenomenally bad 'bad cop' in Vic Mackey and let us root for him to escape justice from week to week. Again, the fact that he was still achieving some for the side of good and at least some of his motivation was to support his sick children probably allowed audiences to give him the benefit of the doubt...

I feel like this type of character has peaked with Walter White in Breaking Bad. In the show's beginning, he was a mildly sympathetic character who was only selling drugs to save up enough cash to support his family in the event he succumbed to cancer. Midway through the 5th season though, he has lost all traits of an anti-hero is essentially just a full blown villain. There is nothing inherently good left in any of his actions.

Is there anywhere left for this kind of character to go? Can a show succeed if the main character BEGINS as evil as Walter White has become?

/rant

I'm not sure how that would even work though - starting off a show with somebody that evil and having him suppose to be the star/hero of the show. It only worked in Breaking Bad because he developed (degenerated?) into that over the seasons.

The closest thing to that description though is a guy you already mentioned, Vic Mackey.

She never gets mentioned but Nancy Botwin is a good example. I still don't know despite how terrible a fukking person she is that she is still liked by viewers of the show.

 

[obarth]

I think Homeland pushed it even further last season. Who would have ever thought Americans would care for, while maybe not necessarily rooting for, a terrorist?

 

[DaylitoJames]

I think Dexter help popularized the trend, the notion of rooting for a serial killer is still strange to me. The last couple of seasons he was good compared to the other serial killers he killed but re-watch the first 2 seasons he was doing shady ass shyt which is what I hope they refer back to for the last 2 seasons.

 

[Mook]

I think Homeland pushed it even further last season. Who would have ever thought Americans would care for, while maybe not necessarily rooting for, a terrorist?

no one's rooting for brody they probably want him to turn good again.

to op stone cold Steve Austin was before sopranos

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

 

[MidniteJay]

Breaking Bad was meant to be that way. It was wrote for the protagonist to turn into the antagonist.

You mean for the protagonist to turn into a villain. I find it funny how those two words (protagonist and antagonist) are misused like that.

Protagonist = the main character of the story. The story most of the time revolves around him/her or carry his/hers point of view. The protagonist while usually the hero can also be an evil son of a bytch villain as well.

Antagonist = is a character that works against the protagonist/main character of the story. Usually assigned to villains but Antagonists can be heroes as well.

For example, In Death Note Yagami Light is the protagonist but a villain and L is trying to put a stop to his killing is the antagonist and the hero.

Both protagonist and antagonist can have the same character alignment as well.

 

[Handsback]

I think Dexter help popularized the trend, the notion of rooting for a serial killer is still strange to me. The last couple of seasons he was good compared to the other serial killers he killed but re-watch the first 2 seasons he was doing shady ass shyt which is what I hope they refer back to for the last 2 seasons.

If we look at it this way, it might have started with Silence of the Lambs. Not a television series but a movie series. I figure its popularity is enough to factor it in.

Hannibal was the draw for the movies and the audience likes him. Yeah he eats people, so what? All those people were a$$holes or child molesters. Dude is just pure evil, but we want to see him succeed. I hear they are coming out with a series for him too.

 

[Rain]

I think Homeland pushed it even further last season. Who would have ever thought Americans would care for, while maybe not necessarily rooting for, a terrorist?

The only thing I was rooting for last season was for that bomb to go off.

EDIT: Damn, I guess I was rooting for the terrorist when you put it in that regard

 

[HHR]

The only thing I was rooting for last season was for that bomb to go off.

EDIT: Damn, I guess I was rooting for the terrorist when you put it in that regard

I think people were rooting for the bomb to go off for the story, not so much "for" the terrorist.

 

[ThatKidBlackHippy]

I think people were rooting for the bomb to go off for the story, not so much "for" the terrorist.

Because there is no clear good or bad in the story. Brodie can't be pigeon-holed into being a pure villain or hero when the entire plot is based on the premise of treading the fine line and making it conflicting for the viewers.

 

[up in here]

If we look at it this way, it might have started with Silence of the Lambs. Not a television series but a movie series. I figure its popularity is enough to factor it in.

Hannibal was the draw for the movies and the audience likes him. Yeah he eats people, so what? All those people were a$$holes or child molesters. Dude is just pure evil, but we want to see him succeed. I hear they are coming out with a series for him too.

anti-heros had been in film way before silence of the lambs. the anti-hero is definitely not new in film, but on tv i think it is definitely more of a recent trend.