Deb Antney (Waka's Mom) says Gucci didn't kill Pookie Loc UPDATE: REAL shooter Identified

[Gritsngravy]

I believe this is it, I just Street Viewed it and this looks like it. For some reason I thought there was a used car dealer next to it, and maybe there was, this was a decade ago or thereabouts that I was there. But this looks like the building and the area...



I guess it's similar in a sense. To my knowledge though Rule and Fif's issues were not from rap though, right? And weren't Jeezy and Gucci's issues something dealing with money over the Icy song?

Both Gucci and 50 got bigger after the beefs though, Gucci never hit the highs Fif hit in the industry, though I definitely think it can be argued Gucci is a better rapper than 50. Fif the better businessman though, he flipped his rap fame into a bunch of different opportunities...

I never thought Ja was that dope, despite how nikkas on here gas him. He had his run of popularity but he was never THAT nice. Jeezy's entrance into the game was more similar to Fif's, he had a legendary opening run, that shyt is above any height Ja hit and shouldn't be forgotten...

I also don't yhink Jeezy was marginalized in the industry the way Ja was. So I guess there's some light similarity here but there's some big differences to me...

I wasn’t old enough to follow the 50 and ja shyt so I don’t know why they beefed but it seemed like jeezy kinda went cold in the streets once Gucci took off, I remember the snowman shirts but like maybe 08 or somewhere along that time Gucci was the only atl nikka folks listened to, he was definitely getting more radio play too

And I assumed that’s kinda what happened with ja too cause he had his moment but I guess the big difference is murder inc got hit with the Rico so of course ja went cold

 

[murksiderock]

I wasn’t old enough to follow the 50 and ja shyt so I don’t know why they beefed but it seemed like jeezy kinda went cold in the streets once Gucci took off, I remember the snowman shirts but like maybe 08 or somewhere along that time Gucci was the only atl nikka folks listened to, he was definitely getting more radio play too

And I assumed that’s kinda what happened with ja too cause he had his moment but I guess the big difference is murder inc got hit with the Rico so of course ja went cold

Jeezy didn't really go cold until the 2010s, and it wasn't until '12 or after that he really fell flat. There was a combination of factors that led to that but mostly he didn't grow enough artistically to stay relevant at the top tier. Those of us who were fans from his heyday still checked for his drops for years, but his music was at its peak when he first came out and his "prime" really kind of ended in 2012...

Gucci's artistic peak was really 2007 to 2010, but Jeezy was still really, really relevant then. Gucci saturated the market, he put out over 20 projects in 3 years, but it worked for him, the quality of everything about his music was better. You gotta understand that because Jeezy came in the game bigger abd harder he didn't have to go so hard initially, he was established, whereas when Wop came in we ("we" meaning most people who aren't Atlanta locals, in Atlanta there were always people who believed in him) viewed him as kind of this one hit hit wonder...

He got outta jail and went scorched earth...

Gucci had to go harder to get to where Jeezy was at but the INITIAL rise of '07 to '10 didn't really hurt Jeezy...

Again there was a combination of factors that led to Jeezy's decline but because these two were always linked, they were always compared to each other. Gucci started separating himself with the success of artists he signed, whereas all Jeezy's artists stagnated. There were also questionable business decisions about his artists while Wop's artists were shining, and Wop also became a hot ticket for features that Jeezy never really was...

Jeezy took alot of bad press in the early 10s but if his artistry continued to grow he could have withstood it. It didn't, so he didn't, it really is as simple as that. Gucci had drama surrounding him too but his artistry carried him beyond it...

Ultimately in my view, I think Wop has the greater hip hop legacy, how he grinded himself into a superstar after a pause that could have crushed his career. He has the stronger legacy in how he introduced relevant acts and his influence on the generation after him. Jeezy's strongest run from 2004 to 2009 is a period of time I think should be rightfully remembered, abd his breakthrough to mainstream popularity in 2004-2005, is iconic, it's a rise only comparable to 50 and a handful of others in how hard he hit the game...

He should be given his respect for that...

But his overall legacy isn't as strong as Gucci's, Gucci should be considered higher on an All-Time hierarchy, though I don't think it's by a large margin. Neither one of them are elite spitters and neither have more than a handful of legit classics, and I'm talking about the art, not just shyt nikkas jam to and casually apply the word classic to. Both have skills and showcased them at different points, bit there is not real separation in the TALENT of them as emcees...

Gucci did more with his opportunity and his opportunity was narrower than Snow's, that's where the separation was claimed. I'm not a fan of Gucci the person, he's not a mark but he's definitely not this Built Ford Tough nikka he's billed himself as and I've always had an issue with guys who tell you one thing and then certain scenarios reveal they are someone else...

But I do, and did, like Gucci the artist, I didn't "love" him, but I liked him, and I respect his hustle. He's grown alot individually which has shown in his art, and I can objectively say he's had the better career than Jeezy, even though I gravitate more to Jeezy the person...

I was in my early teens during the 50/Murder stuff, so I wasn't as cognizant of it, nor did either one of them capture my attention yhe way Jeezy and Gucci did. Other people older than me, and/or from NY, can speak better to the career trajectory of both!

 

[Gritsngravy]

Jeezy didn't really go cold until the 2010s, and it wasn't until '12 or after that he really fell flat. There was a combination of factors that led to that but mostly he didn't grow enough artistically to stay relevant at the top tier. Those of us who were fans from his heyday still checked for his drops for years, but his music was at its peak when he first came out and his "prime" really kind of ended in 2012...

Gucci's artistic peak was really 2007 to 2010, but Jeezy was still really, really relevant then. Gucci saturated the market, he put out over 20 projects in 3 years, but it worked for him, the quality of everything about his music was better. You gotta understand that because Jeezy came in the game bigger abd harder he didn't have to go so hard initially, he was established, whereas when Wop came in we ("we" meaning most people who aren't Atlanta locals, in Atlanta there were always people who believed in him) viewed him as kind of this one hit hit wonder...

He got outta jail and went scorched earth...

Gucci had to go harder to get to where Jeezy was at but the INITIAL rise of '07 to '10 didn't really hurt Jeezy...

Again there was a combination of factors that led to Jeezy's decline but because these two were always linked, they were always compared to each other. Gucci started separating himself with the success of artists he signed, whereas all Jeezy's artists stagnated. There were also questionable business decisions about his artists while Wop's artists were shining, and Wop also became a hot ticket for features that Jeezy never really was...

Jeezy took alot of bad press in the early 10s but if his artistry continued to grow he could have withstood it. It didn't, so he didn't, it really is as simple as that. Gucci had drama surrounding him too but his artistry carried him beyond it...

Ultimately in my view, I think Wop has the greater hip hop legacy, how he grinded himself into a superstar after a pause that could have crushed his career. He has the stronger legacy in how he introduced relevant acts and his influence on the generation after him. Jeezy's strongest run from 2004 to 2009 is a period of time I think should be rightfully remembered, abd his breakthrough to mainstream popularity in 2004-2005, is iconic, it's a rise only comparable to 50 and a handful of others in how hard he hit the game...

He should be given his respect for that...

But his overall legacy isn't as strong as Gucci's, Gucci should be considered higher on an All-Time hierarchy, though I don't think it's by a large margin. Neither one of them are elite spitters and neither have more than a handful of legit classics, and I'm talking about the art, not just shyt nikkas jam to and casually apply the word classic to. Both have skills and showcased them at different points, bit there is not real separation in the TALENT of them as emcees...

Gucci did more with his opportunity and his opportunity was narrower than Snow's, that's where the separation was claimed. I'm not a fan of Gucci the person, he's not a mark but he's definitely not this Built Ford Tough nikka he's billed himself as and I've always had an issue with guys who tell you one thing and then certain scenarios reveal they are someone else...

But I do, and did, like Gucci the artist, I didn't "love" him, but I liked him, and I respect his hustle. He's grown alot individually which has shown in his art, and I can objectively say he's had the better career than Jeezy, even though I gravitate more to Jeezy the person...

I was in my early teens during the 50/Murder stuff, so I wasn't as cognizant of it, nor did either one of them capture my attention yhe way Jeezy and Gucci did. Other people older than me, and/or from NY, can speak better to the career trajectory of both!

They both cool, but Gucci was pretty much the main mainstream dude folks was fukking with during my early teens until waka, future, and drill took off
So I would also have to give the nod to Gucci for strongest legacy, but that boys in da hood verse is probably the hardest verse between the two in my opinion

 

[The Devil's Advocate]

Thug has said on airwaves he a blood, so that means Gunna ain't a snitch?

Is gunna only admitting that thug is a blood on tv or is there a lot more?

Cause if Gunna went on tv and said “yea he’s a blood” and not a peep else, nobody would say he snitched. They’d say “no shyt. He said it 150 times hisself”

But Gunna isn’t JUST saying that and he damn sure ain’t saying it on tv

 

[Born2BKing]

Is gunna only admitting that thug is a blood on tv or is there a lot more?

Cause if Gunna went on tv and said “yea he’s a blood” and not a peep else, nobody would say he snitched. They’d say “no shyt. He said it 150 times hisself”

But Gunna isn’t JUST saying that and he damn sure ain’t saying it on tv

Whatelse is Gunna saying?

 

[The Devil's Advocate]

Whatelse is Gunna saying?

But in court, Gunna acknowledged that he now knows YSL was about more than just music.

“YSL is a music label and a gang and you have personal knowledge that members or associates of YSL have committed crimes in furtherance of the gang,” asked the judge.

“Yes, ma’am,” said Gunna.

 

[Born2BKing]

But in court, Gunna acknowledged that he now knows YSL was about more than just music.

“YSL is a music label and a gang and you have personal knowledge that members or associates of YSL have committed crimes in furtherance of the gang,” asked the judge.

“Yes, ma’am,” said Gunna.

Self snitching 101

 

[Guvnor]

I believe this is it, I just Street Viewed it and this looks like it. For some reason I thought there was a used car dealer next to it, and maybe there was, this was a decade ago or thereabouts that I was there. But this looks like the building and the area...



I guess it's similar in a sense. To my knowledge though Rule and Fif's issues were not from rap though, right? And weren't Jeezy and Gucci's issues something dealing with money over the Icy song?

Both Gucci and 50 got bigger after the beefs though, Gucci never hit the highs Fif hit in the industry, though I definitely think it can be argued Gucci is a better rapper than 50. Fif the better businessman though, he flipped his rap fame into a bunch of different opportunities...

I never thought Ja was that dope, despite how nikkas on here gas him. He had his run of popularity but he was never THAT nice. Jeezy's entrance into the game was more similar to Fif's, he had a legendary opening run, that shyt is above any height Ja hit and shouldn't be forgotten...

I also don't yhink Jeezy was marginalized in the industry the way Ja was. So I guess there's some light similarity here but there's some big differences to me...

Don't ever in your life say something like that. Fifty is a way better rapper and song writer than Gucci any day of the week in any area of lyricism and song writing.

 

[murksiderock]

Don't ever in your life say something like that. Fifty is a way better rapper and song writer than Gucci any day of the week in any area of lyricism and song writing.

I know you don't think 50 said some special shyt in these songs . He rapping the same shyt Gucci rap about and it isn't in a more creative way, either...

I will say thanks for plugging these two songs, I ain't heard em in forever and I fukk with em . Heat particularly had some relatable bars:

"See the shootouts that I been in, by myself/I was locked up in a box, by myself"...

"I done heard about the 50 grand you put in the hood/but your shooters finna get shot, it won't do em no good"...

Relatable lyricism but these aren't special bars and I still say it's debatable who the better spitter is...

 

[Guvnor]

I know you don't think 50 said some special shyt in these songs . He rapping the same shyt Gucci rap about and it isn't in a more creative way, either...

I will say thanks for plugging these two songs, I ain't heard em in forever and I fukk with em . Heat particularly had some relatable bars:

"See the shootouts that I been in, by myself/I was locked up in a box, by myself"...

"I done heard about the 50 grand you put in the hood/but your shooters finna get shot, it won't do em no good"...

Relatable lyricism but these aren't special bars and I still say it's debatable who the better spitter is...

Far from debatable, Gucci is damn near a retarded level rapper. He writes a good song every now and again but he ain't half the writer 50 is.

The imagery and song writing are really fukking amazing in these songs. Where are guccis songs on that level? Man his dusty songs aint shyt compared to these songs man.

Look at this?


Not saying he is Lupe, Mf Doom or even Mos Def lyric wise but he is better than Gucci easily especially with song writing.

 

[ThaPrez]

So I made a post three years ago in this thread:

https://www.thecoli.com/threads/has-any-street-rapper-ever-had-their-character-more-assassinated-in-diss-records-than-jeezy.753439/page-8#post-36121577

I'm having trouble finding a post where I've mentioned that it was alleged he Wop wasn't by himself nor the only shooter that evening. Maybe I thought I mentioned it and didn't, either way, it's always been assumed by most that he was the killer but it's definitely passed thru my ears before that he "possibly" wasn't the only shooter that night or the kill shot...

I think the thing is people who would know, couldn't actually say for sure who killed Pookie. It be like that in shootings where there are multiple shooters (if this was the case). Gucci got off on insufficient evidence, which doesn't mean he wasn't thr killer, but it does mean there's a possibility that he wasn't...

Bringing this and my old post up, because in relation to this thread, while most people would assume Deb is lying, I don't doubt that she's confident in what she's saying and wherever she got this information from. Not at all...

When I was hanging around The A some 9 to 10 years ago, everyone I met in the field, if Gucci was a topic, vouched that he's a street dude, no one ever said otherwise, so he's "official" as far as that goes. As I said in my older post, I knew a guy who grew up with dude, would say shyt that only someone who knew him for a minute would know (shyt like describing the crib Wop grew up in or naming family member names, shyt like that, that I don't have committed to memory). The guy I knew was an official dude certainly, again, I never had any reason to think he was fabricating anything and we had this topic of convo in front of other locals, wasn't nobody saying "nah that ain't true"...

That Pookie Loc case gave Gucci a boogeyman rep and aura within hip hop media and fandom that doesn't match who he's known as by people of his era and around this way. He may have killed Pookie, maybe he didn't, but I've said in a couple different threads, this Super Thug image of Wop isn't how cats who knew him, view him. Guc wasn't a dude cats were terrified of, the way I've always understood it, he was one of many cats from his side, in his era, who were getting dirty. He wasn't distinguished as this killing machine amongst his peers, nor was he known as this trap star...

His reputation with drugs isn't in the same stratosphere as Jeezy's, in relation to getting big money....

All this is relevant because Deb has made it a topic of conversation again. I don't know if Gucci killed fam or not, I really don't care, and I don't know Gucci, never met him, nothing I'm saying is something I know beyond a shadow of a doubt...

I trust what I was told by the people who told me, and I don't think Deb is lying, my assumption would be she trusts whatever information she has. Many of you will think she's on a PR tour to shyt on Wop, that's fine, I don't hate that opinion. We all have ours...

But I'll say what also catches my attention besides the aforementioned is something I know I've brought up several times, I just can't find the posts:

Gucci has lived off that body for nearly 18 years now. If he really did it, it's pretty questionable that he spoke about it so much as he did over the years, because he didn't need to. The dudes who tend to speak incessantly, tirelessly about putting something down tend to be nikkas who not natural killers, and I am speaking firsthand about this, I ain't talking about "rapping" about killing something. Everybody and they mama raps about killing something...

The Culture made it so that the body he caught elevated his reputation, which isn't reality outside in most cases. nikkas who are used to keeping the company of shooters and killers aren't wowed at your body, that's for people (which is most people) who AREN'T used to being acquaintances of shooters...

Especially if the circumstances you caught your body was in self-defense or accidental. You not a shooter. Bunch of non-shooters have verified kills because there's a limitless amount of circumstances that can lead to murder. There are dudes who are actual shooters who haven't actually taken a life from their own hand...

I respect Gucci hustle in how he elevated himself within the industry, he's definitely a living legend. But I'm definitely not one of these people who views him as one of the toughest nikkas ever, in part, we know that isn't true. It is what it is. He really was outside. The guy I knew that grew up with him, never characterized him as a shooter nor killer. Not once. Said he had a few shootouts. Never said Gucci was a "shooter", the dudes who are, are defined by that...

As toxic a conversation as this is, strip away celebrity, these are things people outside really conversate about. First of all you don't get away for 18 mocking how you killed someone's homie, that's #1, there are consequences if you're really that brash and disrespectful. But also, if you're found out to claim a killing that isn't yours, people take that personal. The deceased general have friends and family who care about them too...

Long story short, maybe he did off Pookie, but I doubt Deb is lying about this...

that's a lot of words to make a point we already know.... 90% of rappers exaggerate and portray false images..... that's the game, you market yourself

it's not 1994, keeping it real is a myth

 

[REdefinition]

So Gucci's man admits he was there and was the shooter.

 

[RennisDeynolds]

Wop whole infamy built on lies

 

[MoveForward]

I’ve been telling nikkas that Gucci was a rat with h0e ways since SOHH days. This nikka joined the bloods when he was damn near 30 and he has those big ass fake chiclet teeth in his mouth because he got his teeth knocked out in Dekalb County jail.

 

[CAVEMAN]

So Gucci's man admits he was there and was the shooter.

did you listen to the video? This dude did NOT admit he was the shooter, he ducked and dodged the questions as far as as who shot the guy. Adam22 is a hoe ass liar with misleading titles on his videos to cause drama... All dude said was that he was also there as well and that he got hit in the head with something first so they fought back, that neither him nor Gucci were strapped, but somehow a gun went off and Pookie Loc had got shot. But he didnt at all say that he was the one who fired the shot. Adam kept trying to ask or guide him into saying he did it, and he told Adam ask Deb Antney, since she was the one who claimed it was him. And he said that later on he told Gucci that he'd possibly be willing to take the charges for Guwop if Wop wanted him to, cuz Gucci was his boss, but that Gucci was willing to take the charge himself. This video does not show what the title says it shows, Adam22 is a lying and instigating ass hoe.