Best Player In The World title...

Avisible Man

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Some quick notes:

•'99 was the first year after Mike's second retirement. The only other candidates to this claim that year are Shaq or Duncan, but Malone was the second best player in ball during the second 3peat. He won MVP in '99 and I think overall he was still a better player than both Shaq and Duncan, neither of whom were at the peak they'd become;

•Shaq was the best player in basketball during the 3peat. You could argue '02 Duncan but this is the first example of, I don't believe you can just unseat the incumbent with one year. '02 is the first year Shaq is truly threatened by Duncan on this, even in '99 Duncan wasn't a better player than Shaq yet;

•from '03 on Duncan has it for awhile, possibly from '02. Duncan can be argued for '07 but by that time I think he's fallen some;

•Kobe was being debated as the best player in basketball since around '03 but he wasn't the lead name in any year really until the Nash MVP years. First, he simply wasn't better than Duncan before then. Second, he missed the playoffs in 2005 while playing 66 games, fundamentally I do not think you can be the best player in basketball and your team is a 34-win team who misses the playoffs...

It's not happening, the best player in ball isn't sitting home when the playoffs start if he's healthy...

'06 Kobe had that crazy scoring run and I could see an argument for that year, but it's his first strong year threatening the claim, so I value the incumbent more, 2, I could make a Dirk argument in '06, and 3, he gave up a 3-1 playoff lead. Look at all the examples of All-Timers blowing 3-1 leads in NBA history, and tell me which one had the best player alive. Then come back and explain to me why there's an exception that should be made for '06 Kobe blowing his 3-1 lead...

He pretty comfortably has it in '07 though, as Duncan had just fallen too far and Kobe's consistency of the previous few years takes over...

2010 Kobe, I'll give it to him, but it was the first year I noticed some slippage with him, where he was falling from the conversation. This takes me to LeBron;

•I could make the argument LeBron was the best player in basketball from 2008 thru '20 with no breaks...

But I don't believe he was better than '08 Kobe. I do think he's very arguable as better than '09 and '10 Kobe, but '09 Kobe had his best playoff run. It's 2010 that I think you can make the strongest case for Bron over Kobe...

From '11 on it was clearly Bron every year. '11 Rose and '11 Dirk weren't better basketball players than Bron, nobody said this in real time. '14 Durant and no '14 Spur was better than Bron. '15 Steph wasn't better than Bron...

Steph at no point of his career, until 2021, was a better basketball player than Bron. '16 Steph you could argue had a better year, and he certainly had the regular season, but that postseason and Finals, Bron was better in both...

Kevin Durant was never a better basketball player than LeBron until LeBron started getting hurt. I don't think '17 is a legitimate argument, it's the first year he joined the Warriors, we knew the squad had the 2nd and 3rd greatest players. '18, I'll listen to an argument for, as he went b2b, but Bron had a better postseason and did more heavy lifting;

•'19 Durant is when it came together. Bron got hurt and missed the playoffs, Durant had an outstanding year, and was on his way to an All-Time playoff run before getting hurt. That 12 minutes of play he hit the floor in The Finals, the gap between he and Kawhi was so enormous it was shocking;

•Bron was the best player in 2020, and this takes me to Giannis. Number one, this was the last truly great LeBron year. 2, Giannis won MVP in '19 and '20. '19 was his first year in the convo and he just wasn't better than '19 Durant, and the same Kawhi who disappeared when Durant was on the floor in The Finals, was clearly a better player in the ECF vs Giannis...

So Giannis goes from being overwhelmed in the '19 ECF and choking that series, to choking in the '20 playoffs. He's not there yet, and to be honest, I can entertain an argument that Giannis isn't the best player in '21. But I just don't think KD plays enough games in '21 to justify the title, KD doesn't play at all in '20, Giannis plays KD to a draw in the playoffs and has a great Finals. It's Giannis in '21, and I think he validated this in '22. He was better than Steph;

•Jokic gets it in '23, ironically the year he doesn't win MVP. Embiid has never been better than Jokic. Giannis I think was always better than Jokic but Jokic was threatening the convo in his first two MVP years, and he just takes it last year. He's still that this year, by a comfortable margin...

Now whether Jokic keeps it next year is up for debate, next year hasn't been played yet. But Jokic had a 2-year run minimum he had this title, and was in the conversation the two years prior
...

:mjtf:

And the nerve to trail off with an ellipsis, indicating there was more to come :dead:
 

GreatestLaker

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I don't like how Bill did it. He basically give it to the best player on the championship team as long as they were top 5 that year. The best player isn't always on a title team. I don't even think Duncan himself believes he was the best player from 02 to 07. The best player in the league is the most dominant player. Period. 06 to 08 was Kobe. He gave the title to Kobe in 2010 but not in 2007? Because he was on a title team? Kobe clearly wasn't as good as the 06 to 08 versions. He was suffering from knee injuries. His list makes no sense.
 

IIVI

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I agree for the most part. There is nothing to me that indicates Luka is a better player than Jokic.

I'll go even further and say I don't think Luka/Kyrie is better than a healthy Jokic/Murray as a total duo either.



There's a lot of recency bias right now, but remember Mann made Luka actually have a horrible series. Dude was 20% being guarded by Mann. People are going apeshyt about the Minny series because Luka finally didn't have a matchup that gave him trouble whereas I think there are zero matchups that give Jokic trouble.
 
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SadimirPutin

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IF Tatum wins a chip is he definitively outside the best player in the world conversation? Will he be considered a top 3 player?
 
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