King Kreole

natural blondie like goku
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
16,031
Reputation
4,513
Daps
43,936
Medicare for All: We are already spending $1 trillion per year on the federal level for healthcare between Medicare, Medicaid, the VA. If we’re gonna add another $2 trillion per year to cover everyone, you’d have employers paying a Medicare for All Tax and abandon the premiums they pay for each employee and not have to worry about exponential increases every year. There is a total of 155 million employees in the United States, so the total corporate spending on healthcare is about $1.5 trillion per year.

In addition, Medicare currently spends about $700 billion per year, which adds with the previous amount to $2.2 trillion per year.

Going by the first a rate of cost increase (5% per year), that $2.2 trillion per year adds up to $27.7 trillion over 10 years.

So, by applying a tax on corporations equal to their current spending on employee healthcare and removing existing Medicare spending from the total, that leaves $4.9 trillion dollars over 10 years to be covered by new taxes. That's $490 billion per year if I don't bother to do the inflation calculation this time. The current US federal tax revenue is $3.3 trillion per year, so the extra money needed works out to an 15% increase in revenue which would probably be increasing Medicare payroll taxes and doing real tax reform not the giveaways to the rich.

Federal Jobs Guarantee cost varies. CBPP projects $540B. No one's run a full-blown job guarantee before, so we don't have past examples to model from. But economists at the Levy Institute took a crack at it, and estimated the final net increase in federal spending would be between $260 and $354 billion in the first five years. Then it would fall to $235 to $326 billion over the following five years. The program isn't designed to compete with the private sector for workers. It's not going to continuously jack up its own wage offers to hold onto everyone it employs. As the private sector strengthens from the job guarantee's stimulus, it should draw people off the program and back into private sector employment. Spending on the job guarantee will then shrink, and ultimately stabilize at a lower level. For example: A much more modest version of a job guarantee was attempted in Argentina in the early 2000s. And it shrank 40 percent in just three years as private employment expanded, before the government cut it off. It almost certainly would've gone lower.

Student loan debt forgiveness is totally do-able considering the FED pumped trillions after the financial crisis into banks, asset holdings, and that cash went into inflating a stock market :ufdup:

Free College would be covered by the $80B increase in the defense budget

Expanding Social Security involves lifting the cap on taxable income which is currently at $117,000 or so.

Paid Family Leave, I've seen estimates between $100-$300B a year. It depends on how many weeks, and what kind of model we want to follow. I haven't seen the plan they plastered on the screen.
tenor.gif
 

Jhoon

Spontaneous Mishaps and Hijinks
Joined
Jul 2, 2012
Messages
16,518
Reputation
1,500
Daps
37,706
SMH

They asked how would they pay for providing 9/11 first responders with free healthcare for their diseases they sustained

asking "How do we pay for it" just means they dont want to pay for it.
If we are talking about First Responders, I don’t think they funded that program.

Let me talk to John Stewart about the issue.
 

Copy Ninja

Superstar
Joined
Dec 19, 2014
Messages
9,390
Reputation
721
Daps
33,506
Medicare for All: We are already spending $1 trillion per year on the federal level for healthcare between Medicare, Medicaid, the VA. If we’re gonna add another $2 trillion per year to cover everyone, you’d have employers paying a Medicare for All Tax and abandon the premiums they pay for each employee and not have to worry about exponential increases every year. There is a total of 155 million employees in the United States, so the total corporate spending on healthcare is about $1.5 trillion per year.

In addition, Medicare currently spends about $700 billion per year, which adds with the previous amount to $2.2 trillion per year.

Going by the first a rate of cost increase (5% per year), that $2.2 trillion per year adds up to $27.7 trillion over 10 years.

So, by applying a tax on corporations equal to their current spending on employee healthcare and removing existing Medicare spending from the total, that leaves $4.9 trillion dollars over 10 years to be covered by new taxes. That's $490 billion per year if I don't bother to do the inflation calculation this time. The current US federal tax revenue is $3.3 trillion per year, so the extra money needed works out to an 15% increase in revenue which would probably be increasing Medicare payroll taxes and doing real tax reform not the giveaways to the rich.

Federal Jobs Guarantee cost varies. CBPP projects $540B. No one's run a full-blown job guarantee before, so we don't have past examples to model from. But economists at the Levy Institute took a crack at it, and estimated the final net increase in federal spending would be between $260 and $354 billion in the first five years. Then it would fall to $235 to $326 billion over the following five years. The program isn't designed to compete with the private sector for workers. It's not going to continuously jack up its own wage offers to hold onto everyone it employs. As the private sector strengthens from the job guarantee's stimulus, it should draw people off the program and back into private sector employment. Spending on the job guarantee will then shrink, and ultimately stabilize at a lower level. For example: A much more modest version of a job guarantee was attempted in Argentina in the early 2000s. And it shrank 40 percent in just three years as private employment expanded, before the government cut it off. It almost certainly would've gone lower.

Student loan debt forgiveness is totally do-able considering the FED pumped trillions after the financial crisis into banks, asset holdings, and that cash went into inflating a stock market :ufdup:

Free College would be covered by the $80B increase in the defense budget

Expanding Social Security involves lifting the cap on taxable income which is currently at $117,000 or so.

Paid Family Leave, I've seen estimates between $100-$300B a year. It depends on how many weeks, and what kind of model we want to follow. I haven't seen the plan they plastered on the screen.

I don't know if this math checks out but if this chick had said this, it would have sounded better than what she was saying to Tapper.

Kenneth Thorpe, a health policy professor at Emory University in Atlanta, authored one of the earlier studies and says the Mercatus analysis reinforces them.

"It's showing that if you are going to go in this direction, it's going to cost the federal government $2.5 trillion to $3 trillion a year in terms of spending," said Thorpe. "Even though people don't pay premiums, the tax increases are going to be enormous. There are going to be a lot of people who'll pay more in taxes than they save on premiums." Thorpe was a senior health policy adviser in the Clinton administration.

All these programs, we are all going to be paying higher taxes. Do we really trust the government to run all these programs without corruption?

Here's a look at health insurance companies after Obamacare was passed:
  • Centene (CNC): +742%
  • UnitedHealth (UNH): +578%
  • WellCare (WCG): +538%
  • Cigna (CI): +499%
  • Humana (HUM): +484%
  • Aetna (AET): +452%
  • Molina (MOH): +355%
  • Anthem (ANTM): +289%
I'm wary of government run programs:yeshrug:
 

FAH1223

Go Wizards, Go Terps, Go Packers!
Staff member
Supporter
Joined
May 16, 2012
Messages
74,936
Reputation
8,791
Daps
225,167
Reppin
WASHINGTON, DC
I don't know if this math checks out but if this chick had said this, it would have sounded better than what she was saying to Tapper.



All these programs, we are all going to be paying higher taxes. Do we really trust the government to run all these programs without corruption?

Here's a look at health insurance companies after Obamacare was passed:
  • Centene (CNC): +742%
  • UnitedHealth (UNH): +578%
  • WellCare (WCG): +538%
  • Cigna (CI): +499%
  • Humana (HUM): +484%
  • Aetna (AET): +452%
  • Molina (MOH): +355%
  • Anthem (ANTM): +289%
I'm wary of government run programs:yeshrug:

Health insurance companies have proven they are more bureaucratic, costly, and inefficient than if the federal government was the single payer.

They aren’t government entities but are being subsidized via the ACA.

In a single payer system, we shift it to Medicare and make Medicare better by covering more things, eliminating deductibles, etc.
 

Copy Ninja

Superstar
Joined
Dec 19, 2014
Messages
9,390
Reputation
721
Daps
33,506
The current private healthcare model is corrupt my guy. Corruption is the current business model.

Agreed. And the government has their hand in there. My point is, more government control != less corruption.

Health insurance companies have proven they are more bureaucratic, costly, and inefficient than if the federal government was the single payer.

They aren’t government entities but are being subsidized via the ACA.

In a single payer system, we shift it to Medicare and make Medicare better by covering more things, eliminating deductibles, etc.

That administration will simply shift to the government. Which again i argue is not more efficient.

If we are going with the Canadian model of medicare, then a large portion of healthcare will still be subsidized to private companies. We'll just have the government act as the middle man. Which will cause more inefficiency.

Not to mention people will still need to supplement their healthcare with private insurance because there are going to be procedures/prescription drugs that will not be covered. Which means people will have to pay extra for that, on top of higher taxes.

This shyt is a money grab. Look at the defense and how much $$ is wasted. Social Security has been mismanaged. I'm good with giving more of my money to the government to fukk up:hubie:
 

FAH1223

Go Wizards, Go Terps, Go Packers!
Staff member
Supporter
Joined
May 16, 2012
Messages
74,936
Reputation
8,791
Daps
225,167
Reppin
WASHINGTON, DC
Agreed. And the government has their hand in there. My point is, more government control != less corruption.



That administration will simply shift to the government. Which again i argue is not more efficient.

If we are going with the Canadian model of medicare, then a large portion of healthcare will still be subsidized to private companies. We'll just have the government act as the middle man. Which will cause more inefficiency.

Not to mention people will still need to supplement their healthcare with private insurance because there are going to be procedures/prescription drugs that will not be covered. Which means people will have to pay extra for that, on top of higher taxes.

This shyt is a money grab. Look at the defense and how much $$ is wasted. Social Security has been mismanaged. I'm good with giving more of my money to the government to fukk up:hubie:

We're going to spend far more than $32T over the next 10 years on healthcare. What do you propose? Medicare for All isn't perfect but if its done the correct way and in a way that reigns in hospitals, drug companies from price gouging and setting rates (sort of how we have it in Maryland with all-payer rate setting) then we can start to drive down these crazy costs.
 

AnonymityX1000

Veteran
Joined
Jun 6, 2012
Messages
31,326
Reputation
3,156
Daps
71,412
Reppin
New York
Agreed. And the government has their hand in there. My point is, more government control != less corruption.



That administration will simply shift to the government. Which again i argue is not more efficient.

If we are going with the Canadian model of medicare, then a large portion of healthcare will still be subsidized to private companies. We'll just have the government act as the middle man. Which will cause more inefficiency.

Not to mention people will still need to supplement their healthcare with private insurance because there are going to be procedures/prescription drugs that will not be covered. Which means people will have to pay extra for that, on top of higher taxes.

This shyt is a money grab. Look at the defense and how much $$ is wasted. Social Security has been mismanaged. I'm good with giving more of my money to the government to fukk up:hubie:
Small price to pay for everyone being covered. Can we get civilized on this? People look for every excuse to be terrible to their fellow human beings.
 

AlainLocke

Banned
Joined
Dec 16, 2015
Messages
16,258
Reputation
2,680
Daps
74,070
I don't know if this math checks out but if this chick had said this, it would have sounded better than what she was saying to Tapper.



All these programs, we are all going to be paying higher taxes. Do we really trust the government to run all these programs without corruption?

Here's a look at health insurance companies after Obamacare was passed:
  • Centene (CNC): +742%
  • UnitedHealth (UNH): +578%
  • WellCare (WCG): +538%
  • Cigna (CI): +499%
  • Humana (HUM): +484%
  • Aetna (AET): +452%
  • Molina (MOH): +355%
  • Anthem (ANTM): +289%
I'm wary of government run programs:yeshrug:

Breh....

Building roads is a gov program
Environmental protection is a gov program
Public schools are gov program
Job Safety is a gov program
Checking to see if our food is a gov program
National parks is a gov program
Social security is a gov program

Most of the good civilizing shyt comes from government cause the gov doesn't have a profit motive...

And the gov doesn't have to money from doing shyt like making sure there is no lead in our food...or making sure our kids can read

Where do people get the idea that the private sector gives a fukk about people or the private sector isn't corrupt

These are the same people that can literally fail and crash the economy and wake away with 300 million
 

Geek Nasty

Brain Knowledgeably Whizzy
Supporter
Joined
Jan 30, 2015
Messages
31,414
Reputation
5,398
Daps
118,778
Reppin
South Kakalaka
They basically get her in and ask questions like how you gonna pay for it as a gotcha. Like, I pay $1000 a month for an apartment. New one costs $800 a month, that’s $9,600 a year!!! How am I gonna pay for it??!

Stupid level.

The media has been filled with a lot of biased headlines lately. "Ocasia-Cortez tries to explain how to pay for huge cost for her policies" classic rich folks pulling the strings shyt.

She already explained it. Single payer is more efficient than the current system for one and second, you save more in teh long run because more people get preventative care.
 

Don Homer

Molto Bene
Supporter
Joined
Aug 25, 2013
Messages
31,803
Reputation
5,891
Daps
108,079
Higher taxes :bryan:

These dudes always forget the part about no deductibles, no copays, no monthly premiums, no emergency room charges, no urgent care bills, and no insurance middleman trying to make a buck on your healthcare.
yeah....forget. Riiiight....
 

Copy Ninja

Superstar
Joined
Dec 19, 2014
Messages
9,390
Reputation
721
Daps
33,506
Breh....

Building roads is a gov program
Environmental protection is a gov program
Public schools are gov program
Job Safety is a gov program
Checking to see if our food is a gov program
National parks is a gov program
Social security is a gov program

Most of the good civilizing shyt comes from government cause the gov doesn't have a profit motive...

And the gov doesn't have to money from doing shyt like making sure there is no lead in our food...or making sure our kids can read

Where do people get the idea that the private sector gives a fukk about people or the private sector isn't corrupt

These are the same people that can literally fail and crash the economy and wake away with 300 million

I agree breh. The government does a lot of needed shyt. But even amongst the things you listed, which are absolutely necessary, there's a lot of waste. And yeah, private sector is only looking for the bottom line, but at least were not paying them with our taxes. Unless they're getting government contracts:bryan:


We're going to spend far more than $32T over the next 10 years on healthcare. What do you propose? Medicare for All isn't perfect but if its done the correct way and in a way that reigns in hospitals, drug companies from price gouging and setting rates (sort of how we have it in Maryland with all-payer rate setting) then we can start to drive down these crazy costs.

If these socialists are serious about these enormous social programs, then to start I want to hear about cutting defense (get out of all these stupid wars we are in) and shift some of that budget to these programs, harder line on illegal immigration (less burden on these programs), higher taxes for the 10% (leave the midde class alone).
 
Top