A federal court takes tech companies’ power to moderate (no more Twitter jail)

Adeptus Astartes

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This is supposed to be "Higher Learning", so it's amazing how often people who have done absolutely zero research into an issue feel free spouting off their opinions as if they were Delivered Truths (TM) without even addressing the counterarguments that were brought up.

I already said my use of the service has literally nothing to do with it.
You didn't provide a counterargument. Social media is not school placement, health insurance, or loan approval. Stay on topic.

Something "fukking up society" in your opinion is no reason to give more regulatory power to government. Thats how we got prohibition, the drug war, and many other horrible policies.

The one in OP is a prime example. Conservatives beleive social media is censoring conservative viewpoints/pushing liberalism (fukking up society in their opinion), so they are demanding more government control.
 
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Professor Emeritus

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You didn't provide a counterargument. Social media is not school placement, health insurance, or loan approval. Stay on topic.


You're just making yourself look worse and worse. I gave a clear, well-known, established argument, and when you spoke as if you weren't even familiar with the position I gave you some background reading you could do to get familiarity. Instead of educating yourself you're just spouting more irrelevant nonsense. What's the point of me arguing it out with someone who has no background in the topic, is not interested in getting background, and has already committed to an ideological position with no actual interest in the facts?

Are you trying to claim that social media doesn't use secret algorithms, or that those algorithms don't have massive repercussions for society and democracy, or....what exactly? The issues with secret algorithms influencing the direction of society are deeply relevant to social media, how could you even argue otherwise? A quick search shows Facebook alone is mentioned 60 times in the 172-page book I posted.

Like I said, do yourself a favor and read something on the topic. Look, I found the whole thing free in case that $5 option earlier was too high a barrier:

 

Adeptus Astartes

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You're just making yourself look worse and worse. I gave a clear, well-known, established argument, and when you spoke as if you weren't even familiar with the position I gave you some background reading you could do to get familiarity. Instead of educating yourself you're just spouting more irrelevant nonsense. What's the point of me arguing it out with someone who has no background in the topic, is not interested in getting background, and has already committed to an ideological position with no actual interest in the facts?

Are you trying to claim that social media doesn't use secret algorithms, or that those algorithms don't have massive repercussions for society and democracy, or....what exactly? The issues with secret algorithms influencing the direction of society are deeply relevant to social media, how could you even argue otherwise? A quick search shows Facebook alone is mentioned 60 times in the 172-page book I posted.

Like I said, do yourself a favor and read something on the topic. Look, I found the whole thing free in case that $5 option earlier was too high a barrier:


I never said they don't have secret algorithms.

I don't care that you believe social media is "fukking up society".MAGA conservatives believe the same thing for different reasons. Which government ideology gets to regulate social media and for what reasons? How will they do it? State by state? Federal laws that change every time congress changes? Can't you see the can of worms this opens up?

I believe that the best course of action, short of outlawing algorithm based feeds entirely, is to maintain the existing section 230 system. Government stays hands off, and sites moderate as they see fit. Government is welcome to create its own social media, or create and disseminate counter info or awareness/education programs to tell people what they fear is wrong with social media. People are also free not to use the services, or choose alternatives.

I will not apologize for my belief that government protecting people from themselves by force is wrong.
 

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I don't care that you believe social media is "fukking up society".MAGA conservatives believe the same thing for different reasons.

You do realize that's a pathetic logical fallacy that adds nothing to the conversation, right?



Which government ideology gets to regulate social media and for what reasons? How will they do it? State by state? Federal laws that change every time congress changes? Can't you see the can of worms this opens up?

Breh that's literally the argument against every government regulation ever, you're continuing to add nothing. No "can of worms" is opened up here that hasn't already been open since our system of government began.

You know where the answer to your questions are? In the book. There are very clear bare-minimum rules for algorithm sanity laid out in the book and they're based on a robust discussion that has been ongoing for years now. You have just entered in with an ideological viewpoint and you're refusing to even educate yourself on the issue.
 
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On its face, I have no issue with this. No one was getting banned from Twitter because of "political positions". They were being banned for encouraging violence, engaging in hate speech, and fomenting insurrection.

As it stands, nothing should change as far as users are concerned. Social media companies are going to be getting sued left and right, and it will probably be more annoyance than anything.
 

Adeptus Astartes

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You do realize that's a pathetic logical fallacy that adds nothing to the conversation, right?





Breh that's literally the argument against every government regulation ever, you're continuing to add nothing. No "can of worms" is opened up here that hasn't already been open since our system of government began.

You know where the answer to your questions are? In the book. There are very clear bare-minimum rules for algorithm sanity laid out in the book and they're based on a robust discussion that has been ongoing for years now. You have just entered in with an ideological viewpoint and you're refusing to even educate yourself on the issue.
Its not a fallacy. It's a perfectly reasonable question that you refuse to answer because it makes you question your position of, "regulation is good".

You have concerns about social media algorithms. Your ideological enemies have the same concerns. Who gets the power to implement their solution?

I do not agree that your concerns merit direct government regulation because I do not believe they should have that power.

Your other paragraph is again you refusing to engage. I am talking about this specific regulation, not regulation in general. If this writer's solution was actually going to be implemented, and implemented universally, you may have a point. However, you are not stupid enough to think that this will actually happen in reality. Those who want to regulate social media have made no secret that they want to do so for partisan and ideological reasons. This case in particular is a glowing example. Giving them this power is unwise.
 
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☑︎#VoteDemocrat

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This is supposed to be "Higher Learning", so it's amazing how often people who have done absolutely zero research into an issue feel free spouting off their opinions as if they were Delivered Truths (TM) without even addressing the counterarguments that were brought up.

I already said my use of the service has literally nothing to do with my issues with the impact of algorithms.
This dude really loves smelling himself
 

Dr. Acula

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Yeah, I wonder if Republicans will apply these laws to THEIR social media companies. Gab has banned people for leftist opinions. Being anti Trump can get you banned from TS.
At the very least, folks should be licking their chops for an easy lick on those platforms.
 

☑︎#VoteDemocrat

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Are you trying to claim that social media doesn't use secret algorithms, or that those algorithms don't have massive repercussions for society and democracy, or....what exactly? The issues with secret algorithms influencing the direction of society are deeply relevant to social media, how could you even argue otherwise? A quick search shows Facebook alone is mentioned 60 times in the 172-page book I posted.
I, don't care.
 

☑︎#VoteDemocrat

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bullshyt ass law got slapped down. Properly 🫡


Supreme Court Blocks Texas Law Regulating Social Media Platforms​

The law, prompted by conservative complaints about censorship, prohibits big technology companies like Facebook and Twitter from removing posts based on the views they express.​

May 31, 2022, 5:31 p.m. ET
The case is pending before a federal appeals court and may return to the Supreme Court.

The case is pending before a federal appeals court and may return to the Supreme Court.Tom Brenner for The New York Times
WASHINGTON — The Supreme Court on Tuesday blocked a Texas law that would ban large social media companies from removing posts based on the views they express.
The court’s brief order was unsigned and gave no reasons, which is typical when the justices act on emergency applications. The order was not the last word in the case, which is pending before a federal appeals court and may return to the Supreme Court.
The vote was 5 to 4, with an unusual coalition in dissent. The court’s three most conservative members — Justices Samuel A. Alito Jr., Clarence Thomas and Neil M. Gorsuch — filed a dissent saying they would have let stand, for now at least, an appeals court order that left the law in place while the case moved forward. Justice Elena Kagan, a liberal, also said she would have let the order stand, though she did not join the dissent and gave no reasons of her own.
Justice Alito wrote that the issues were so novel and significant that the Supreme Court would have to consider them at some point.
“This application concerns issues of great importance that will plainly merit this court’s review,” he wrote. “Social media platforms have transformed the way people communicate with each other and obtain news. At issue is a groundbreaking Texas law that addresses the power of dominant social media corporations to shape public discussion of the important issues of the day.”
Justice Alito said he was skeptical of the argument that the social media companies have editorial discretion protected by the First Amendment like that enjoyed by newspapers and other traditional publishers.
“It is not at all obvious,” he wrote, “how our existing precedents, which predate the age of the internet, should apply to large social media companies.”
The law’s supporters said the measure was an attempt to combat what they called Silicon Valley censorship, saying major platforms had removed posts expressing conservative views. The law was prompted in part by the decisions of some platforms to bar President Donald J. Trump after the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the Capitol.
The law, H.B. 20, applies to social media platforms with more than 50 million active monthly users, including Facebook, Twitter and YouTube. It does not appear to reach smaller platforms that appeal to conservatives, like Truth Social and Gettr, the law’s challengers told the Supreme Court.
:mjlol:
The law also does not cover sites that are devoted to news, sports, entertainment and other information that their users do not primarily generate. The covered sites are largely prohibited from removing posts based on the viewpoints they express, with exceptions for the sexual exploitation of children, incitement of criminal activity and some threats of violence.
:mjpls:
According to two trade groups that challenged the law, the measure “would compel platforms to disseminate all sorts of objectionable viewpoints — such as Russia’s propaganda claiming that its invasion of Ukraine is justified, ISIS propaganda claiming that extremism is warranted, neo-Nazi or K.K.K. screeds denying or supporting the Holocaust, and encouraging children to engage in risky or unhealthy behavior like eating disorders.”
The law requires platforms to be treated as common carriers that must convey essentially all of their users’ messages rather than as publishers with editorial discretion.
In a separate case last week, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 11th Circuit largely upheld a preliminary injunction against a similar Florida law.
“Social media platforms exercise editorial judgment that is inherently expressive,” Judge Kevin C. Newsom wrote for the panel. “When platforms choose to remove users or posts, deprioritize content in viewers’ feeds or search results, or sanction breaches of their community standards, they engage in First Amendment-protected activity.
The First Amendment generally prohibits government restrictions on speech based on content and viewpoint. In their emergency application to the Supreme Court, the trade groups challenging the Texas law said it ran afoul of those principles at every turn. “H.B. 20 is a flatly unconstitutional law that compels government-preferred speech from select private entities and would require enormous upheaval to the worldwide operations of covered internet websites,” the application said.
In response to the emergency application, Ken Paxton, Texas’ attorney general, wrote that “the platforms are the 21st-century descendants of telegraph and telephone companies: that is, traditional common carriers.” That means, Mr. Paxton wrote, that they must generally accept all customers.
Judge Robert Pitman of the Federal District Court in Austin issued a preliminary injunction blocking the law in December. “Social media companies have a First Amendment right to moderate content disseminated on their platforms,” wrote Judge Pitman, who was appointed by President Barack Obama.
The state’s appeal was argued on May 9 in the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit. Two days later, a divided three-judge panel of the court stayed Judge Pitman’s injunction and allowed the law to go into effect. The panel has not yet issued a ruling on the merits of the appeal.
The members of the panel — Judge Edith H. Jones, who was appointed by President Ronald Reagan; Judge Leslie H. Southwick, who was appointed by President George W. Bush; and Judge Andrew S. Oldham, who was appointed by Mr. Trump — gave no reasons for their votes, saying only that “the panel is not unanimous.”
The trade groups challenging the Texas law — NetChoice and the Computer & Communications Industry Association — are represented by prominent conservative lawyers, including Scott A. Keller and Kyle Hawkins, who served as solicitors general of Texas, and Paul D. Clement, who served as U.S. solicitor general in Mr. Bush’s administration. In their emergency application to the Supreme Court, they wrote that social media companies’ content moderation policies were crucial to their identities and missions.
“Without these policies,” they wrote, “these websites would become barnacled with slurs, pornography, spam and material harmful to children.”
 
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