Official 2023-2024 Detroit Lions Thread.

Regular_P

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Za'Darius Smith backed out of his deal with the Ravens. The Lions should be making a run at him. They have $22 million left in cap space this year and the cap really opens up over the next two years.

I don't expect them to restructure half the roster and go nuts with spending but they should be adding some impact players, especially when they have exactly zero at the moment.
 

IrateMastermind

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Holmes says Chark fits their football culture but why did they give him just a one year deal?

Probably because he's coming off injury. I wouldn't want to sign long term if I was Chark knowing I'm coming in to possibly be the feature this year.
 

IrateMastermind

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Rumor is the Rams are looking at releasing Woods after signing Robinson. The lions should make a play for him. He'd complete the wr room imo.
 

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Athletic guys being diplomatic about free agency but they sound concerned like myself.

Lions takeaways: What's the NFL Draft plan now at No. 2? Plus, safety questions and the QB picture

By Nick Baumgardner and Chris Burke Mar 21, 2022
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GM Brad Holmes made no bold promises. And after one week, the Lions’ overall approach during free agency has been predictably circumspect if nothing else.

The Lions re-signed a pair of starters the organization deemed culture fits in safety Tracy Walker and edge rusher Charles Harris, plus wide receiver Kalif Raymond and linebacker Alex Anzalone. Detroit also brought in 25-year-old wide receiver DJ Chark on a one-year prove-it deal. Chark, a second-round pick from LSU in 2018, was a Pro Bowler for Jacksonville in 2019.

Was this enough? Lions writers Nick Baumgardner and Chris Burke have thoughts.

Baumgardner: So the Lions didn’t do anything I’d call surprising during free agency, but they did address a few questions that needed answers — namely, re-upping both Walker and Harris.

Chris, what’s still a serious concern for you with the Lions’ defense? Are you more confident in the unit’s direction now as opposed to, say, a week ago?

Burke: It’s fair to say that all of it is still a concern, right? The edge spot has a ton of variables — Romeo Okwara’s health, Charles Harris being able to repeat his 2021, the draft. They’re a little thin along the interior. They need another linebacker, multiple safeties, maybe a cornerback. There’s still time to check off most of these boxes, but I wouldn’t say things are significantly better than last season.


The Walker signing was important, though. We talked all season long about the need to keep him around, because of how much he meant on and off the field. How’d you feel about Harris, at two years and (up to) $13 million?

Baumgardner: I was mostly fine with it. His number for 2022 isn’t insane ($3.1 million) and if he can’t back up his production from a year ago, it won’t break the Lions to get out of the deal next offseason and move on. And if he’s as good, then the Lions have shown the locker room they’re willing to invest in character guys. Same thing with Walker, to be frank. He had a much better 2021 season. But Detroit didn’t make an iron-clad, long-term commitment. If he’s not still showing continued improvement within two years, the team can move on.

The Lions have done all the things they’ve said they were going to do. When it comes to building, protecting and advancing their culture, this free agency period was a win. But a lot of questions still remain. You already mentioned the secondary: The Lions still need at least one more safety, and maybe two. Corner is in no way settled. Stack linebacker (at least one, maybe two) needs to be addressed.

They have the picks. But, uh … am I panicking now?


USATSI_17021872-1024x758.jpg


The Lions re-signed safety Tracy Walker last week. (Robert Hanashiro / USA Today)

Burke: So, this is more or less what I covered in Friday’s free-agency reset. People are freaking out that the 2022 roster is going to be Chark and the 2021 Lions, which is understandable. But this is also exactly how they said they were going to do this — jump into the market without sacrificing the future, lean into the draft and try to have things ready to go by Year 3 and 4.

Some of this probably comes down to what your expectations are in 2022. The NFC North is kinda falling apart, and the NFC as a whole looks fairly wide open. Does it get you closer to the finish line to bring in veterans who can make you 9-8 and a wild-card contender? You probably could do it without sacrificing too much of the future.


Give me the next two or three moves you’d prioritize here.

Baumgardner: The first thing I’d do is figure out who plays next to Walker at safety. Should I use one of my first two picks on a safety, ride with Will Harris or see if I can add a free-agent project? That can, to me, can no longer be kicked. The Lions picked a direction with Walker; this is a split-safety defense; they need to pick a direction with his partner.

The second thing I’d do is find Derrick Barnes’ future partner at stack linebacker. We’ve talked about possibly needing two more guys here, because Anzalone won’t be with the Lions long-term. We still don’t know if Barnes is an answer, but we also know Detroit needs more depth there.


Addressing cornerback, of course, would be third. That state of that position is, at best, really unclear. Your thoughts?

Burke: We had this exact conversation in the Lions’ press room, in between player availability on Friday. The question was, essentially: How do you line up the cornerback depth chart right now? Is Jeff Okudah a guaranteed starter? Would you drop in a veteran free agent over Ifeatu Melifonwu?

And my answer was/is that they should still have a lot of irons in the fire. I don’t know that anyone aside from Melifonwu and maybe a healthy Jerry Jacobs is 100 percent in the plans for 2023, let alone beyond that. I also don’t think anyone other than maybe Oruwariye is guaranteed playing time next season.

The way I see it, they still need at least three playable defensive backs — two safeties and a corner or one of each plus a hybrid or … split it however you want. They’re way short. Which forces me to ask: Did they make a mistake by not being more aggressive on the early safety market?

Baumgardner: This actually spins me into the next part of our discussion: How did free agency impact the draft for Detroit, specifically at the No. 2 pick?

The Lions’ decision to spend a relatively modest amount on Walker rather than jumping into the deep end of the pool when they had a need (and the money) makes me wonder if Kyle Hamilton isn’t more of a need-based decision at No. 2, so long as he checks all the boxes for Detroit.

I’ve had no problem with him at 2 when we’ve gone through mocks; I think he’s good enough to take there as a back-end hybrid. But if the Lions don’t choose Hamilton, or if they don’t use a relatively premium pick on a safety and a corner … then I’ll be scratching my head, yes. I don’t think I’d call it a mistake to sit that market out. But Aaron Glenn can’t keep turning guys no one’s ever heard of into starters. He needs more talent and it’s time to invest.

So, to you: Did the first week of free agency change anything in your mind about what the Lions should do with the No 2 pick? For our purposes in this discussion, Aidan Hutchinson has gone No. 1 to Jacksonville. It seems more likely every day.

Burke: That’s an unfortunate wrinkle — not even necessarily because the Lions are all-in on Hutchinson, but because it takes part of the conversation out of their hands. As things stand, they absolutely need to draft a safety, probably early. Does that mean Hamilton? I don’t know. I doubt they’re suddenly going to panic and slant the board for need at No. 2.

The Chark signing and retaining Josh Reynolds frees them up to do whatever they want at receiver. It’s a talented, deep class so they should get in on it, but they don’t need to come out of Round 1 or 2 with a starter.

Everything still feels at about the same spot, for me. They’ll be heavily invested on defense, and they’ll need to come out with three to five starters, at whatever positions. How are you feeling now?

GettyImages-1235658529-1024x683.jpg


Will Notre Dame safety Kyle Hamilton be in the mix for the Lions at No. 2? (Robin Alam / Icon Sportswire via Getty Images)

Baumgardner: Totally agree on wide receiver. The moves there open up other interesting possibilities later in the draft and take pressure off early. But, again: That’s a good thing only if the Lions take advantage and give Glenn premium ammo to work with in the defensive backfield.

Glenn won’t be running Detroit’s defense forever. If I were the Lions, I’d get as many high-talent, young defensive backs as I could fit on my roster around both Glenn and Aubrey Pleasant. That has to be a theme in this draft, the same way Detroit made shoring up the front a theme last year. The Lions hammered defensive tackle with premium resources and now are developing Levi Onwuzurike and Alim McNeill.

Now they need to do the same thing with the secondary.


Burke: I’m also required by law to ask if you’ve changed your mind at all about the quarterbacks. Because I do think it’s interesting that the Lions keep building this offense — vertical threats on the outside, rolling pockets, play action — for a quarterback that’s, well, not really Jared Goff.

Can I interest you at all in Malik Willis turning it loose for Chark and Reynolds?

Baumgardner: Oh yeah, you can interest me in Malik Willis. Whether we (or Twitter) can interest Holmes in him is another matter.

The biggest question I have about the Lions’ quarterback situation right now is why they were so quick to re-up Tim Boyle. I understand why they like David Blough — he’s the No. 3 locker-room guy who is the starter’s therapist, friend, etc. But if he’s here, then I think the No. 2 spot needs to be devoted to long-range development.

Boyle was hurt last year, but what we did see from him wouldn’t make me just close the book on taking a quarterback in this draft, if one is available at the right spot. And, to be fair, the Lions can still do that. It’s not like they gave Boyle a mammoth deal. Perhaps it was a “we’d rather do this right now than lose him” move. Not sure.

What are your thoughts on all this, because it definitely got more interesting.

Burke: There are ways to make this draft work with a quarterback selected at No. 2 and a lot of defense the rest of the way. I’m not saying that’s how I would go with it, but it is very doable.

But, again, the overall focus hasn’t changed that much for me. Willis (or Kenny Pickett or whomever) always felt like an outside possibility for them, mainly because of this big-picture rebuild we just discussed. That’s still the same.

Close it out here: What’s the next move?

Baumgardner: Take some pressure off yourself, if you can, and find a veteran defensive back who can give you something — doesn’t have to be every rep, every game — on the field while helping young guys around him. Those are difficult jobs to fill because defensive backs, like receivers, are some of the most competitive people in football. But that’s what they need.

Same question to you.

Burke: Yeah, I think it’s a veteran DB. They’re higher on Will Harris than literally anyone else, but they’re not oblivious to the situation.
 
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djthegreat88

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Athletic guys being diplomatic about free agency but they sound concerned like myself.

Lions takeaways: What's the NFL Draft plan now at No. 2? Plus, safety questions and the QB picture

By Nick Baumgardner and Chris Burke Mar 21, 2022
comment-icon@2x.png
67
save-icon@2x.png

GM Brad Holmes made no bold promises. And after one week, the Lions’ overall approach during free agency has been predictably circumspect if nothing else.

The Lions re-signed a pair of starters the organization deemed culture fits in safety Tracy Walker and edge rusher Charles Harris, plus wide receiver Kalif Raymond and linebacker Alex Anzalone. Detroit also brought in 25-year-old wide receiver DJ Chark on a one-year prove-it deal. Chark, a second-round pick from LSU in 2018, was a Pro Bowler for Jacksonville in 2019.

Was this enough? Lions writers Nick Baumgardner and Chris Burke have thoughts.

Baumgardner: So the Lions didn’t do anything I’d call surprising during free agency, but they did address a few questions that needed answers — namely, re-upping both Walker and Harris.

Chris, what’s still a serious concern for you with the Lions’ defense? Are you more confident in the unit’s direction now as opposed to, say, a week ago?

Burke: It’s fair to say that all of it is still a concern, right? The edge spot has a ton of variables — Romeo Okwara’s health, Charles Harris being able to repeat his 2021, the draft. They’re a little thin along the interior. They need another linebacker, multiple safeties, maybe a cornerback. There’s still time to check off most of these boxes, but I wouldn’t say things are significantly better than last season.


The Walker signing was important, though. We talked all season long about the need to keep him around, because of how much he meant on and off the field. How’d you feel about Harris, at two years and (up to) $13 million?

Baumgardner: I was mostly fine with it. His number for 2022 isn’t insane ($3.1 million) and if he can’t back up his production from a year ago, it won’t break the Lions to get out of the deal next offseason and move on. And if he’s as good, then the Lions have shown the locker room they’re willing to invest in character guys. Same thing with Walker, to be frank. He had a much better 2021 season. But Detroit didn’t make an iron-clad, long-term commitment. If he’s not still showing continued improvement within two years, the team can move on.

The Lions have done all the things they’ve said they were going to do. When it comes to building, protecting and advancing their culture, this free agency period was a win. But a lot of questions still remain. You already mentioned the secondary: The Lions still need at least one more safety, and maybe two. Corner is in no way settled. Stack linebacker (at least one, maybe two) needs to be addressed.

They have the picks. But, uh … am I panicking now?


USATSI_17021872-1024x758.jpg


The Lions re-signed safety Tracy Walker last week. (Robert Hanashiro / USA Today)

Burke: So, this is more or less what I covered in Friday’s free-agency reset. People are freaking out that the 2022 roster is going to be Chark and the 2021 Lions, which is understandable. But this is also exactly how they said they were going to do this — jump into the market without sacrificing the future, lean into the draft and try to have things ready to go by Year 3 and 4.

Some of this probably comes down to what your expectations are in 2022. The NFC North is kinda falling apart, and the NFC as a whole looks fairly wide open. Does it get you closer to the finish line to bring in veterans who can make you 9-8 and a wild-card contender? You probably could do it without sacrificing too much of the future.


Give me the next two or three moves you’d prioritize here.

Baumgardner: The first thing I’d do is figure out who plays next to Walker at safety. Should I use one of my first two picks on a safety, ride with Will Harris or see if I can add a free-agent project? That can, to me, can no longer be kicked. The Lions picked a direction with Walker; this is a split-safety defense; they need to pick a direction with his partner.

The second thing I’d do is find Derrick Barnes’ future partner at stack linebacker. We’ve talked about possibly needing two more guys here, because Anzalone won’t be with the Lions long-term. We still don’t know if Barnes is an answer, but we also know Detroit needs more depth there.


Addressing cornerback, of course, would be third. That state of that position is, at best, really unclear. Your thoughts?

Burke: We had this exact conversation in the Lions’ press room, in between player availability on Friday. The question was, essentially: How do you line up the cornerback depth chart right now? Is Jeff Okudah a guaranteed starter? Would you drop in a veteran free agent over Ifeatu Melifonwu?

And my answer was/is that they should still have a lot of irons in the fire. I don’t know that anyone aside from Melifonwu and maybe a healthy Jerry Jacobs is 100 percent in the plans for 2023, let alone beyond that. I also don’t think anyone other than maybe Oruwariye is guaranteed playing time next season.

The way I see it, they still need at least three playable defensive backs — two safeties and a corner or one of each plus a hybrid or … split it however you want. They’re way short. Which forces me to ask: Did they make a mistake by not being more aggressive on the early safety market?

Baumgardner: This actually spins me into the next part of our discussion: How did free agency impact the draft for Detroit, specifically at the No. 2 pick?

The Lions’ decision to spend a relatively modest amount on Walker rather than jumping into the deep end of the pool when they had a need (and the money) makes me wonder if Kyle Hamilton isn’t more of a need-based decision at No. 2, so long as he checks all the boxes for Detroit.

I’ve had no problem with him at 2 when we’ve gone through mocks; I think he’s good enough to take there as a back-end hybrid. But if the Lions don’t choose Hamilton, or if they don’t use a relatively premium pick on a safety and a corner … then I’ll be scratching my head, yes. I don’t think I’d call it a mistake to sit that market out. But Aaron Glenn can’t keep turning guys no one’s ever heard of into starters. He needs more talent and it’s time to invest.

So, to you: Did the first week of free agency change anything in your mind about what the Lions should do with the No 2 pick? For our purposes in this discussion, Aidan Hutchinson has gone No. 1 to Jacksonville. It seems more likely every day.

Burke: That’s an unfortunate wrinkle — not even necessarily because the Lions are all-in on Hutchinson, but because it takes part of the conversation out of their hands. As things stand, they absolutely need to draft a safety, probably early. Does that mean Hamilton? I don’t know. I doubt they’re suddenly going to panic and slant the board for need at No. 2.

The Chark signing and retaining Josh Reynolds frees them up to do whatever they want at receiver. It’s a talented, deep class so they should get in on it, but they don’t need to come out of Round 1 or 2 with a starter.

Everything still feels at about the same spot, for me. They’ll be heavily invested on defense, and they’ll need to come out with three to five starters, at whatever positions. How are you feeling now?

GettyImages-1235658529-1024x683.jpg


Will Notre Dame safety Kyle Hamilton be in the mix for the Lions at No. 2? (Robin Alam / Icon Sportswire via Getty Images)

Baumgardner: Totally agree on wide receiver. The moves there open up other interesting possibilities later in the draft and take pressure off early. But, again: That’s a good thing only if the Lions take advantage and give Glenn premium ammo to work with in the defensive backfield.

Glenn won’t be running Detroit’s defense forever. If I were the Lions, I’d get as many high-talent, young defensive backs as I could fit on my roster around both Glenn and Aubrey Pleasant. That has to be a theme in this draft, the same way Detroit made shoring up the front a theme last year. The Lions hammered defensive tackle with premium resources and now are developing Levi Onwuzurike and Alim McNeill.

Now they need to do the same thing with the secondary.


Burke: I’m also required by law to ask if you’ve changed your mind at all about the quarterbacks. Because I do think it’s interesting that the Lions keep building this offense — vertical threats on the outside, rolling pockets, play action — for a quarterback that’s, well, not really Jared Goff.

Can I interest you at all in Malik Willis turning it loose for Chark and Reynolds?

Baumgardner: Oh yeah, you can interest me in Malik Willis. Whether we (or Twitter) can interest Holmes in him is another matter.

The biggest question I have about the Lions’ quarterback situation right now is why they were so quick to re-up Tim Boyle. I understand why they like David Blough — he’s the No. 3 locker-room guy who is the starter’s therapist, friend, etc. But if he’s here, then I think the No. 2 spot needs to be devoted to long-range development.

Boyle was hurt last year, but what we did see from him wouldn’t make me just close the book on taking a quarterback in this draft, if one is available at the right spot. And, to be fair, the Lions can still do that. It’s not like they gave Boyle a mammoth deal. Perhaps it was a “we’d rather do this right now than lose him” move. Not sure.

What are your thoughts on all this, because it definitely got more interesting.

Burke: There are ways to make this draft work with a quarterback selected at No. 2 and a lot of defense the rest of the way. I’m not saying that’s how I would go with it, but it is very doable.

But, again, the overall focus hasn’t changed that much for me. Willis (or Kenny Pickett or whomever) always felt like an outside possibility for them, mainly because of this big-picture rebuild we just discussed. That’s still the same.

Close it out here: What’s the next move?

Baumgardner: Take some pressure off yourself, if you can, and find a veteran defensive back who can give you something — doesn’t have to be every rep, every game — on the field while helping young guys around him. Those are difficult jobs to fill because defensive backs, like receivers, are some of the most competitive people in football. But that’s what they need.

Same question to you.

Burke: Yeah, I think it’s a veteran DB. They’re higher on Will Harris than literally anyone else, but they’re not oblivious to the situation.
Well Holmes and Campbell got 6 year deals. Their probably in no rush
 

Piff Perkins

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They're dedicated to a long term rebuild. If you truly believe the NFC North is imploding this season, it'll be imploding next season as well (GB in cap hell, Bears rebuilding, Vikings rebuilding). So I'm not really motivated by that. My only problem with the offseason is resigning Boyle. Blough is better and we're gonna draft a later round QB most likely so why not let Boyle walk.

In terms of missing pieces yea LB and S come to mind but...who is there that would fit, and who would want to come into an obvious rebuild? Honey Badger wants to win, he's not coming here.

Lions worked out Arden Key today which suggests maybe we aren't going DE at 2. Maybe we take Hamilton, brehs. Maybe they think Okwara coming back solves the pass rush. Regardless end of the day...the end game for all this remains acquire assets. Do you want to win 7-8 meaningless games next year, or tank enough to get our QB next draft.
:yeshrug:
 

Regular_P

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Well Holmes and Campbell got 6 year deals. Their probably in no rush
But they should be putting some pieces in place this offseason. Windows open and close quickly in the NFL. Teams can go from meh to contender in a heartbeat because you never know when one of these QBs is gonna become available.

Tampa didn't make the playoffs for over a decade but had some talent on the roster. Then Brady wants out of NE and they were prepared for him. Denver's been in a holding pattern waiting for a QB and Russ wanted to go there because of what's in place even though they haven't made the playoffs since Peyton retired. The Browns have been loading up on talent and now they have Deshaun Watson.

This team needs to begin putting real pieces in place because you never know when a big time QB is gonna become available like Mahomes, Kyler Murray or Lamar Jackson. Situations can deteriorate quickly and unexpectedly.

The plan cannot be: we're gonna build through the draft for four years. The guys you drafted four years ago might get injured and need to be replaced. That's how football works.

The Rams won the Super Bowl because they never stopped adding premium talent. They always pushed to acquire more.
 

djthegreat88

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Remember Campbell praising him and wanting him to stay when he got hired. Was definitely used wrong by Patricia. Low risk signing
 

Piff Perkins

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But they should be putting some pieces in place this offseason. Windows open and close quickly in the NFL. Teams can go from meh to contender in a heartbeat because you never know when one of these QBs is gonna become available.

Tampa didn't make the playoffs for over a decade but had some talent on the roster. Then Brady wants out of NE and they were prepared for him. Denver's been in a holding pattern waiting for a QB and Russ wanted to go there because of what's in place even though they haven't made the playoffs since Peyton retired. The Browns have been loading up on talent and now they have Deshaun Watson.

This team needs to begin putting real pieces in place because you never know when a big time QB is gonna become available like Mahomes, Kyler Murray or Lamar Jackson. Situations can deteriorate quickly and unexpectedly.

The plan cannot be: we're gonna build through the draft for four years. The guys you drafted four years ago might get injured and need to be replaced. That's how football works.

The Rams won the Super Bowl because they never stopped adding premium talent. They always pushed to acquire more.
No one said only build through the draft, they simply declined to spend this year. I’m fine with it. We got a shyt ton of draft picks and I’d imagine some smaller FA signings are coming.

Next year I’d expect to trade up for a QB and spend heavy in FA.
 
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