how the fukk do I make my beats fuller? (nexus related)

Deafheaven

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B86

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I used to play with music just for fun so I know a little bit, but going to a specific preset in any given vst isn't what gives you a fuller sound. Listen for the sections you think sounds empty and fill them in. It's hard to describe but open up your mind and listen.....when you finally experience what I'm saying, you will never have th is issue again. It doesn't even have to be complex either to make it sound full. A few notes here and there abd you'll be surprised at the outcome
 

CJBeatzNYC

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To make your beats overall fuller sounding, I would recommend mastering your finished mixes, have you tried any mastering plugins like T-Racks or anything like that?
 

producingfire

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Depends on what you mean by full are you trying to just give it a broader by giving it a richer texture or making it so that its more like a final product? if its the first option, I would layer everything till it sounds full (Stacking the clap/Snare/ kick drum Etc. The second option is using a compressor preferably a multiband compressor So that you can control multiple frequencies. Doing both of these should give you what you want.
 

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Breh I know exactly what you're saying. It's all about sound designing and understanding the frequency spectrum. Been study this shyt for a few months and im still like :mindblown:.
 

Deafheaven

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Breh I know exactly what you're saying. It's all about sound designing and understanding the frequency spectrum. Been study this shyt for a few months and im still like :mindblown:.


frequency spectrum :mindblown:

I'm changing my major to music to go into audio egineering so I'll more than likely know this shyt eventually but uhhhhhh I want to figure it out now :damn:




I think what I'm really trying to get at is that my beats are like all samples. I want to be able to incorporate more shyt into them so that the sample is there but not the whole thing you feel me.

like this shyt

https://soundcloud.com/kushskywalker/big-boss

the sample is there but the real star is allt he other shyt going on.
 
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KushSkywalker

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@Zeu$ it takes alot of trial an error to get comfortable filling the beat out. I wish I had one thing I could tell you I do but I don't really. I just know what I WANT it to sound like, and try everything I know til I get it as close as possible.

A few tips,


1. If your instincts tell you it feels empty, walk away from the beat for a day or two, and play it again fresh, and see what your impression is then. If it's still empty there may be a melody or a sound that needs beefin up. Sometimes less is more though.



2. Get a MIDI keyboard and start learning some scales and chords. In that Big Boss beat I just sped up the sample, filtered it and started hitting random chops until I got something that sounded cool. Then I thought to add some bass. So i took that rolling bass sound and started hitting keys random until I figured out what few notes were the correct scale for the key of the sample. Then I was able to play the melodies by restricting myself to that scale, keep in mind I DONT play keyboard. (maybe a lil bit :lolbron:)




3. Do you use an audio interface and monitors? or just your soundcard and headphones/computer speakers? If you have an audio interface one thing I've learned to get my beats fuller/louder is to restrict your interfaces output volume during the creation and mixing. For instance, most things sound 'better' to the human ear if they are louder, but that doesn't mean they are better. So if you create and mix your beat with your interfaces volume all the way up, you may think it's louder (better) than it actually is. Instead make the beat with the interfaces volume at 'unity gain' it means 0 db. Basically set the volume to 12' o clock, or if it's a traditional mixer set it to 0-db. don't turn it up or down. If something in the beat sounds too quiet turn IT up or down.




4. Layer sounds. Everyone know I use a lot of 808's. But what might be more hidden is that almost every track has live drums or a sample breakbeat chopped riding behind it too. I may have 10-15 tracks just dedicated to drums, even more sometimes. Drums on point is goal #1 in hip hop to me. Layer live cymbals with 808 cymbals. Put an 808 kick behind a sampled kick. Throw a 3rd kick that sounds weird over those and see what it sounds like.




5. Frequency spectrum. Every sound takes of space in the frequency spectrum. http://home.tir.com/~ms/concepts/concepts.html

sph-analyzer.png


I look at the spectrum as a cabinet with a bunch of shelve's on it. Now you'll have to properly fill each shelf for the cabinet to be full right? leave a few cans off the bass shelf and its not full, feel me? So you have to start to learn, OK the bassline is dominating from 60hz to 120hz, but the kick has some oomph at 90hz, but the body of the kick is much higher at like 250hz. So how do they share space in the cabinet without taking up space on eachothers shelves? You have to make it fit. In this case you could cut off the bottom end of the kick at 120hz so it doesn't fight with the bass, then maybe boost at 250hz a little so the oomph of the kick comes through without the bass sounding any different. I know this prolly sounds like crazy talk but you'll feel me eventually.

Basically the bass will live on the 60-120hz range ALONE without the kick fighting it and the kick will live from 120hz to 150hz ALONE, if you EQ and filter correctly.

The problem is that's just one example, the next beat might require something completely different, takes a while to train your ear, and if your space isn't acoustically correct you could be compensating for the wrong stuff.

Sounds are real waveforms actually moving through the air. The lower the frequency the longer the waveform. So a bass note could be like 20ft long for instance, where as a hi hat is gonna be like a few inches long.

So imagine a 20 foot bass wave length hitting you wall in a 10-15 ft room, part of that wave is going to bounce off the back wall and go by your ears a second time before the whole wave's even out, this is gonna make the bass sound louder and more muffle to you, when in reality it's not, its your room. So if you didn't know you might turn the bass down thinking it's too loud, but in the next guys sound system or headphones it might sound lacking.

This is also one example though, acoustically treating a room is VERY complicated, and Im not suggesting to outright do it, but a little bit can help. Say a bass trap in the corner, some reflective absorption on the walls behind the monitors.




6. About the nexus and how the presets sound shytty. I found this to be true with all 'critically acclaimed' vsts. A lot of awesome sounds sound shytty individually all alone. You need to play with layering them with multiple other sounds, learning what the knobs do in the vst to tweak and create you own presets, you need to experiment with delays and reverbs on the vst. Then try layering it with sounds from other vsts, even copy and paste a recorded melody real quick to see what it sounds like.



I can't tell you how many sounds didn't sound cool until I started playing them IN the beat, but solo that same sound and it's :scusthov:

I hope this helps, I have to stop rambling at some point, hopefully the advice is not too convoluted.
 
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producingfire

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@Zeu$ it takes alot of trial an error to get comfortable filling the beat out. I wish I had one thing I could tell you I do but I don't really. I just know what I WANT it to sound like, and try everything I know til I get it as close as possible.

A few tips,


1. If your instincts tell you it feels empty, walk away from the beat for a day or two, and play it again fresh, and see what your impression is then. If it's still empty there may be a melody or a sound that needs beefin up. Sometimes less is more though.



2. Get a MIDI keyboard and start learning some scales and chords. In that Big Boss beat I just sped up the sample, filtered it and started hitting random chops until I got something that sounded cool. Then I thought to add some bass. So i took that rolling bass sound and started hitting keys random until I figured out what few notes were the correct scale for the key of the sample. Then I was able to play the melodies by restricting myself to that scale, keep in mind I DONT play keyboard. (maybe a lil bit :lolbron:)




3. Do you use an audio interface and monitors? or just your soundcard and headphones/computer speakers? If you have an audio interface one thing I've learned to get my beats fuller/louder is to restrict your interfaces output volume during the creation and mixing. For instance, most things sound 'better' to the human ear if they are louder, but that doesn't mean they are better. So if you create and mix your beat with your interfaces volume all the way up, you may think it's louder (better) than it actually is. Instead make the beat with the interfaces volume at 'unity gain' it means 0 db. Basically set the volume to 12' o clock, or if it's a traditional mixer set it to 0-db. don't turn it up or down. If something in the beat sounds too quiet turn IT up or down.




4. Layer sounds. Everyone know I use a lot of 808's. But what might be more hidden is that almost every track has live drums or a sample breakbeat chopped riding behind it too. I may have 10-15 tracks just dedicated to drums, even more sometimes. Drums on point is goal #1 in hip hop to me. Layer live cymbals with 808 cymbals. Put an 808 kick behind a sampled kick. Throw a 3rd kick that sounds weird over those and see what it sounds like.




5. Frequency spectrum. Every sound takes of space in the frequency spectrum. http://home.tir.com/~ms/concepts/concepts.html

sph-analyzer.png


I look at the spectrum as a cabinet with a bunch of shelve's on it. Now you'll have to properly fill each shelf for the cabinet to be full right? leave a few cans off the bass shelf and its not full, feel me? So you have to start to learn, OK the bassline is dominating from 60hz to 120hz, but the kick has some oomph at 90hz, but the body of the kick is much higher at like 250hz. So how do they share space in the cabinet without taking up space on eachothers shelves? You have to make it fit. In this case you could cut off the bottom end of the kick at 120hz so it doesn't fight with the bass, then maybe boost at 250hz a little so the oomph of the kick comes through without the bass sounding any different. I know this prolly sounds like crazy talk but you'll feel me eventually.

Basically the bass will live on the 60-120hz range ALONE without the kick fighting it and the kick will live from 120hz to 150hz ALONE, if you EQ and filter correctly.

The problem is that's just one example, the next beat might require something completely different, takes a while to train your ear, and if your space isn't acoustically correct you could be compensating for the wrong stuff.

Sounds are real waveforms actually moving through the air. The lower the frequency the longer the waveform. So a bass note could be like 20ft long for instance, where as a hi hat is gonna be like a few inches long.

So imagine a 20 foot bass wave length hitting you wall in a 10-15 ft room, part of that wave is going to bounce off the back wall and go by your ears a second time before the whole wave's even out, this is gonna make the bass sound louder and more muffle to you, when in reality it's not, its your room. So if you didn't know you might turn the bass down thinking it's too loud, but in the next guys sound system or headphones it might sound lacking.

This is also one example though, acoustically treating a room is VERY complicated, and Im not suggesting to outright do it, but a little bit can help. Say a bass trap in the corner, some reflective absorption on the walls behind the monitors.




6. About the nexus and how the presets sound shytty. I found this to be true with all 'critically acclaimed' vsts. A lot of awesome sounds sound shytty individually all alone. You need to play with layering them with multiple other sounds, learning what the knobs do in the vst to tweak and create you own presets, you need to experiment with delays and reverbs on the vst. Then try layering it with sounds from other vsts, even copy and paste a recorded melody real quick to see what it sounds like.



I can't tell you how many sounds didn't sound cool until I started playing them IN the beat, but solo that same sound and it's :scusthov:

I hope this helps, I have to stop rambling at some point, hopefully the advice is not too convoluted.


That pretty much covers a lot. If you want to learn everything now, I would focus on maybe 1 or 2 of those things each time and then gradually add on especially if you want to permanently understand it. You mentioned you were going to music school, that will definitely help a lot, Scales keys. As Kush stated, when you first load the presets they are going to sound terrible. It all changes with a good amount of mixing and layering. Even the free Vst's can be made to sound like gold. After all they are just sounds at the end of the day what matters is what we can do with them. I see what you mean now you want to incorporate more composition around the sample to add to the character of the song. Midi Keyboards definitely help so you can play a long with the sample identifying the key of the song. However if you don't have a midi keyboard, you can still Identify the key and transpose the sound to fit the project key and lace it over the sample that way. All of this won't come overnight but gradually you will understand more and more.
 

DevanteCash

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Damn those samples, Kingdom hearts aha, but honestly it's all about EQing and layering certain sounds. I always layer my kicks and layer a snare with a clap. When it comes to filling in your beat you're going to need melodies. Sometimes it's about finding that PERFECT sound. You might already have the melody played just broze through your sounds.
 

KushSkywalker

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frequency spectrum :mindblown:

I'm changing my major to music to go into audio egineering so I'll more than likely know this shyt eventually but uhhhhhh I want to figure it out now :damn:




I think what I'm really trying to get at is that my beats are like all samples. I want to be able to incorporate more shyt into them so that the sample is there but not the whole thing you feel me.

like this shyt

https://soundcloud.com/kushskywalker/big-boss

the sample is there but the real star is allt he other shyt going on.

I forgot I made a video of all the individual parts of this beat.

I show how I layered different filtered parts of the sample on each other and the different vst sounds I added individually

Might not be any help, but n e way :manny:

 
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