Google engineers want to make ad-blocking (near) impossible

bnew

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Google engineers want to make ad-blocking (near) impossible​

In recent news, Google has put forth a proposal known as the "Web Environment Integrity Explainer", authored by four of its engineers. On the surface, it appears to be a comprehensive effort to enhance trust and security in the digital landscape. However, as with many sweeping technological proposals, it's not without controversy. The tech community, […]

Alex Ivanovs avatar
Alex Ivanovs
July 26, 2023 Updated
3 min Read
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In recent news, Google has put forth a proposal known as the "Web Environment Integrity Explainer", authored by four of its engineers.

On the surface, it appears to be a comprehensive effort to enhance trust and security in the digital landscape. However, as with many sweeping technological proposals, it's not without controversy.

The tech community, especially on GitHub, has raised several eyebrows and voiced significant criticism.

Mozilla has just come out to say that they oppose this proposal, "Detecting fraud and invalid traffic is a challenging problem that we're interested in helping address. However this proposal does not explain how it will make practical progress on the listed use cases, and there are clear downsides to adopting it."

Another update
- It looks like Google is already pushing this into Chromium; you can see the commit on GitHub here. And you can also read this article from Interpeer, which explains the motives behind this proposal.

The Core Proposal: A Trust-Privacy Trade-off?​

Google's proposal pivots on a key premise: enhancing trust in the client environment. It introduces a new API that allows websites to request a token, providing evidence about the client code's environment. Google's engineers elaborate, "Websites funded by ads require proof that their users are human and not bots...Social websites need to differentiate between real user engagement and fake engagement...Users playing online games want assurance that other players are adhering to the game's rules."

However, the critics argue that the quest for trust may come at the expense of privacy. While Google ensures that the tokens will not include unique identifiers, critics fear that this system, if misused, could lead to unwarranted surveillance and control.

Veiled DRM and the Threat to Open Web​

The proposed API, while framed as a tool for fostering trust, could potentially be used to control user behavior on the web. Some critics fear it could be a covert introduction of Digital Rights Management (DRM) into web pages, making ad-blocking near impossible.

This not only impacts user experience but also raises concerns about net neutrality and the open nature of the web. As one critic aptly questioned, "Could this be a veiled attempt at introducing DRMs for web pages, making ad-blocking near-impossible in the browser?"

Monopolization Fears: Who Controls the Attesters?​

A significant concern stemming from the tech community is the potential for monopolistic control. By controlling the "attesters" that verify client environments, Google, or any other big tech company, could potentially manipulate the trust scores, thereby deciding which websites are deemed trustworthy. This opens up a can of worms regarding the democratic nature of the web.

As one GitHub user commented, "This raises a red flag for the open nature of the web, potentially paving the way for a digital hierarchy dominated by a few tech giants."

What About Browser Modifications and Extensions?​

Google's proposal remains ambiguous about its impact on browser modifications and extensions. It attests to the legitimacy of the underlying hardware and software stack without restricting the application’s functionality.

However, how this plays out with browsers that allow extensions or are modified remains a grey area. As the proposal vaguely mentions, "Web Environment Integrity attests the legitimacy of the underlying hardware and software stack, it does not restrict the indicated application’s functionality."

Unanswered Questions and The Path Forward​

The proposal leaves several questions unanswered and open for discussion. For instance, it doesn't clearly address how it will prevent the signal from being used to exclude vendors. Google's engineers write, "Attesters will be required to offer their service under the same conditions to any browser who wishes to use it and meets certain baseline requirements."

However, it's unclear how these baseline requirements will be set and who will enforce them.

In conclusion, while Google's proposal is a technically sophisticated attempt to enhance trust on the web, its potential implications for user privacy and the open nature of the web cannot be ignored. The tech community's concerns highlight the need for a balanced approach that doesn't compromise on either trust or privacy.

It's crucial that the tech community continues to engage in these debates to ensure that the future of the web is shaped by openness, privacy, and freedom rather than control and surveillance.
 

GnauzBookOfRhymes

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They’ll bush this idea like they do everything else not named Android

breh I think this is a hill that googles of the world have to be willing to die on. This is just the opening salvo.

The proliferation of AI is just too dangerous to their bottom line.

AI is already ruining the internet and by extension Google itself.

I'm not a techie so if I'm saying something dumb please point it out but think about youtube for instance. Creators get paid based on people watching their videos, viewing/clicking on ads etc. What's to stop sophisticated programmers from creating bots that can sit there manufacturing views/clicks? Bots that can scour the internet and essentially take over unsuspecting computers worldwide to do the same?

I think stuff like this is why google search has gone to shyt. Everything is fake engagement driving shytty websites to the front page of the internet. And if advertisers don't trust the numbers they're going to pressure google to fix the situation or demand lower rates etc.
 

Joe Sixpack

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breh I think this is a hill that googles of the world have to be willing to die on. This is just the opening salvo.

The proliferation of AI is just too dangerous to their bottom line.

AI is already ruining the internet and by extension Google itself.

I'm not a techie so if I'm saying something dumb please point it out but think about youtube for instance. Creators get paid based on people watching their videos, viewing/clicking on ads etc. What's to stop sophisticated programmers from creating bots that can sit there manufacturing views/clicks? Bots that can scour the internet and essentially take over unsuspecting computers worldwide to do the same?

I think stuff like this is why google search has gone to shyt. Everything is fake engagement driving shytty websites to the front page of the internet. And if advertisers don't trust the numbers they're going to pressure google to fix the situation or demand lower rates etc.
I think you’re right I have alot of fun with how Google constantly bushes things but this will probably be different they have to have a workaround on ad blockers that’s how they make money
 

The Bilingual Gringo

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I hate the current tracking based system of internet marketing and advertising.
 

GnauzBookOfRhymes

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I think you’re right I have alot of fun with how Google constantly bushes things but this will probably be different they have to have a workaround on ad blockers that’s how they make money

I think a lot of these tech firms operate like private equity groups who don't need investors bc they managed to dominate some other wildly lucrative space (search/ads/cloud in case of google; social media for facebook etc). They have groups that come up with all kinds of shyt and a lot of their hiring revolves around product managers etc who can nurture a project until it reaches the market to see if it takes off. If it does great. If it doesn't, it gets bushed. They only have to be successful once a decade.
 

greenvale

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I’m not gonna lie I use ublock origin and another ad blocker and I saw an ad sneak through the other day on YouTube :wow:
 

Ciggavelli

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Ad block is basically useless nowadays. Every major site blocks access if you have it on. ublock Origin works well though, until it won't. You can always use noscript and block all scripts (which blocks basically all ads), but it breaks a lot of sites.

These companies definitely want to eliminate ad blocking tools 100%. They all make money for ads. I'm surprised google even allows ad blocking plug-ins on Chrome.
 

Payday23

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Ad block is basically useless nowadays. Every major site blocks access if you have it on. ublock Origin works well though, until it won't. You can always use noscript and block all scripts (which blocks basically all ads), but it breaks a lot of sites.

These companies definitely want to eliminate ad blocking tools 100%. They all make money for ads. I'm surprised google even allows ad blocking plug-ins on Chrome.
The internet will always be ahead of these companies. Until they turn it off
 

bnew

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no one benefits from a global EMP.

A.I on the empact of an EMP:
A global EMP attack would be a catastrophic event that could cause widespread damage and disruption to the U.S. and other countries. According to experts, an EMP could disable, damage or destroy: 1

  • TVs, radios and other broadcast equipment
  • Power grid transformers and substations
  • Telephones (land lines) and smartphones
  • Vehicle and aircraft control systems
  • Computers and all internet connected devices
  • Refrigerators
  • Generators
  • Satellites potentially within the range of the EMP
The loss of electricity and communication would have severe consequences for society, such as: 23456

  • The collapse of the national command authority and military communications
  • The breakdown of law and order and civil unrest
  • The disruption of global commerce and stability
  • The shortage of food, water, medicine and other essential supplies
  • The exposure to extreme weather conditions and environmental hazards
  • The malfunction of nuclear power plants and the release of radioactive radiation
  • The increase of mortality and morbidity rates due to disease, injury and starvation
 

bnew

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I just watched a vid that explains if they didn't people wouldn't use Chrome and that's a far bigger fear for them

they definitel ywouldn't have had mass adoption by the tech crowd and devs if they didn't have ad-block support early on.

embrace, extend and extinguish.:francis:
 
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