MenacingMonk
Tranquilo
It really makes me 
how submissions are nerfed.
how submissions are nerfed.
Anyone else tired of the prolonged Submission hold?
- Thread starter MenacingMonk
- Start date
Walls of Jericho was a top 5 finisher back in the day to me. Get it applied in the center of the ring. It was over. No matter the name. Now it’s 99.9 pct of the time just wasting time in the ring. So yea op I’m wit ya
El Cocodrilo
Superstar
It's all booking; if you had some people lose to submissions more often you'd be set but you know it's just a cheap way to build tension in the match so nobody is falling for it
MenacingMonk
Tranquilo
I understand being in a move for 20 seconds, but when it goes over 40-45 seconds it’s ridiculous.
They put over Bryan"s submission big time during 2013/14. Can't remember the last one that got pushed so hard
That's why the Michaels/Angle match at WM 21 ended horribly...amongst other things.It really makes me
No. Done right it builds tension and if that's not the finish then the "injury" plays into the rest of the match.
These days if a guy is in it for awhile, it usually just kills the move because it's just another sequence.
These days if a guy is in it for awhile, it usually just kills the move because it's just another sequence.
Mikael Blowpiff
#LosIngobernabrehs
just have them not get all of it. when its fully locked in then shyts done. there.
martin payne
All Star
im always 
when i see a sleeper hold
get rid of all of em
when i see a sleeper holdget rid of all of em
I have this theory that UFC/MMA messed it all up. Before UFC/MMA got popular, I don't think people actually knew how long a submission could be put on someone before the victim gives up. So Ric Flair putting on a figure four leglock for two minutes was perfectly normal and there would still be drama if he'd win from that hold. Well, once people saw that in real life it only takes a few seconds for someone to tapout, it subconsciously translated over to pro wrestling. So once the first few seconds pass and there isn't a tap out, then people kinda stop buying it as a finish.
MenacingMonk
Tranquilo
I feel you. But I rarely watch UFC. I just remember how vicious submissions used to be.
It really depends on the situation, sometimes a submission can take forever to set up and sometimes it's quick to lead to a stoppage. But I think what the rise of MMA changed for pro wrestling was that people ended fights unpredictably, and when you watch a fight, the smallest mistake can lead to the end of a fight. There are no surprises in or out of the ring in pro wrestling.
1) Not many people use submissions as their finisher anymore
Why?
2) Wrestling has gravitated towards more strike heavy matches
Why?
3) A meta happened where people figured out hitting your finisher out of nowhere gets a huge pop, and is advantageous for run-ins and other fukkery. This works with strikes and slams way more than submissions. It is also more exciting to spam strikes/slams (superkicks / flippyshyt) than work a limb the whole match
Example.
4) Go watch a ZSJ match, anyone but the purest of wrestling fan will be bored out of their skull.
Why?
2) Wrestling has gravitated towards more strike heavy matches
Why?
3) A meta happened where people figured out hitting your finisher out of nowhere gets a huge pop, and is advantageous for run-ins and other fukkery. This works with strikes and slams way more than submissions. It is also more exciting to spam strikes/slams (superkicks / flippyshyt) than work a limb the whole match
Example.
4) Go watch a ZSJ match, anyone but the purest of wrestling fan will be bored out of their skull.
Figure 4s legit hurt quickly though
Definitely came in to say this. The suspension of disbelief is a bit fukked right now. Like now that people grasp how these holds go on a basic level, it just makes it look a bit ridiculous. Restholds are definitely done for me due to this. Like a sleeper puts you out in SECONDS.
I don't see it happening but in my mind, you'd have more fights to really lock these things on. But wrestling is set in its ways and to make them more realistic would fukk up the flow we're all used to. I also think WWE needs to kill closed hand punches again. But that's another convo.